17 replies to this topic

[Alucard648]

The quest is released. 

 

Got stuck? Found a bug? Post here.

[Moosh]

Decided to give this a go. About 1/3 of the way through it if the puzzle numbers are to be trusted. A lot of these puzzles I've just stumbled onto solutions by accident which indicates to me that they're both too easy and more importantly, not telegraphed well enough. I'm glad they're not the kind of obtuse that stumps me to the point of giving up, but it's odd when just trying to figure out the mechanics through experimentation is enough to accidentally find a solution. I also really question the decision to have optional collectibles in a linear stage based quest with zero replay value, as I am certain I will inevitably miss one and be locked out of content. Seems like they'd have made more sense as hint coins like in the Layton games allowing you some extra direction or even to outright skip puzzles. Of course this would also require that the puzzles get harder, which remains to be seen. 

 

On the whole I'd say the quest is an improvement over the first two which I had no interest in at all, but there's still a lot of room to improve. The idea of an fully puzzle based adventure game has worked before (Layton) but this particular quest has not been showing the puzzles at their strongest. Unsure if I'll finish it or not, but I wanted to get my thoughts out just in case.

[Alucard648]

I also really question the decision to have optional collectibles in a linear stage based quest with zero replay value, as I am certain I will inevitably miss one and be locked out of content.

Will it be good in future update to add gates that prevent player from finishing level until all previous rupees are collected?

[Moosh]

Will it be good in future update to add gates that prevent player from finishing level until all previous rupees are collected?

Perhaps rather than a hard gate just a counter per area showing how many you could have by the end. That way they can still be optional but player will know if they miss one. The awkward design here has already been set in stone so that seems like the best compromise to make it more player friendly while preserving what's there.

[Alucard648]

The milestones are simple - 7 per area, including starting area. Exception is final area (9 rupees). Tips and Cheats section of database entry will be updated.

Spoiler

If you encounter Nyarlathotep with less than 91 rupees, better restart - you missed some.

Edited by Alucard648, 24 September 2024 - 11:10 AM.

[Moosh]

I think even if they're a consistent number per area a counter would still be helpful for keeping track and peace of mind.

 

Anyways, I'm at the 80% mark now. The difficulty curve has definitely caught up, though it's still a bit inconsistent. I have accumulated a handful of suggestions and criticisms relating to a common design element in your puzzles that being the letter and number counters used for password entry.

• I don't like that you have to stand on the faces to trigger them, especially so in the passwords where you're cycling through the whole alphabet. It just takes that little bit of extra mental processing remembering how many times you've hit the button to be annoying. If you could trigger them from the tile below it'd be much better, though this isn't possible for every puzzle type.
• Hand in hand with the first part, I think they could use a way to decrement the counter in addition to incrementing them.
• The default tile font used in Classic is a little hard on the eyes sometimes. When there's big arrays of letters or numbers I find myself wishing there was a bit of room between the characters and the edge of the tiles. Or I'd find myself mixing up the rounder letters like C and G. An option for a smaller font would be welcome.
• Colors can also be a bit off. I don't suffer from any sort of color blindness, but when looking at many lighter shades on light backgrounds it can cause a bit of strain. Sometimes unavoidable perhaps, but once again, smaller characters could allow for things like outlines to improve that contrast.
• Sometimes the number fields let you enter more options than there are legal inputs. Once again, this just makes it more awkward when you overshoot.

 

Despite having nearly all these issues at once, I could not bring myself to dislike the Sudoku puzzles. It's just that peak, only held back by ZC's screen size.

[Alucard648]

Updated as per suggestions.

[Moosh]

Okay I'm just walled by puzzle 94. The hint seems like it ought to be simple but it sure isn't triggering. My assumption here is that:

Spoiler

I need to enter a straight and a full house. Presumably the center digit on both should be a 6. I can't ascertain any other rules from the clue.

 

Also realizing I don't think I've seen puzzle 95. Unsure if that's part of what I'm missing or if other puzzle numbers have been skipped,..

[Alucard648]

Okay I'm just walled by puzzle 94. The hint seems like it ought to be simple but it sure isn't triggering. My assumption here is that:

Spoiler

I need to enter a straight and a full house. Presumably the center digit on both should be a 6. I can't ascertain any other rules from the clue.

 

Also realizing I don't think I've seen puzzle 95. Unsure if that's part of what I'm missing or if other puzzle numbers have been skipped,..

Spoiler

Does the inputing straight then full house poker combinations work, like similar puzzles in Ulthar and Ngranek. like putting 23456 and 11122? Accessing #95 requires all 6 keys. Have you seen house with 6 lockblocks?

Edited by Alucard648, 01 October 2024 - 04:56 AM.

[Moosh]

Spoiler

Does the inputing straight then full house poker combinations work, like similar puzzles in Ulthar and Ngranek. like putting 23456 and 11122? Accessing #95 requires all 6 keys. Have you seen house with 6 lockblocks?

Spoiler

It does not work. I did this several times with several different combinations and nothing happened. Concerning...

 

I've seen the lock blocks but am missing the key from this screen.

[Alucard648]

Spoiler

It does not work. I did this several times with several different combinations and nothing happened. Concerning...

 

I've seen the lock blocks but am missing the key from this screen.

Spoiler

Checked scripts. Turns out bottom part of keyboard is bugged. Use 12345 22233 for now. Update bugfix is on the way.

[Moosh]

I'm not sure what the final puzzle solution is intended to be, but I'm also 1 rupee short so I suppose this is the end either way. Puzzle 99 was the hardest for me by far aside from the torus sliding tile puzzles which consistently gave me the most difficulty. I think my issue there was once again a conveyance one.

 

Spoiler

I failed to read the combos in the center as mirrors, instead assuming they were either block-alls or decoration. That tile doesn't get used much in quests and even then you need some ZC specific knowledge to recognize what it's supposed to be. So I spent a long time trying to get the block in a position that was totally impossible.

 

Overall my favorite puzzles in the quest were 98, 90 (hardest one IMO), and 51. I like puzzles that have me scratching my head for a bit but have a method I either instantly grasp or can learn by doing (oh boy did I learn some things about the torus puzzle). This is of course a tricky balance because it's hard to challenge the player with concepts they already know.

[TheLinkToThePast]

Yes I did make an account here just to comment on this thing. I'm not sorry.

 

I wanted to like this quest. I really did. I tried. Me and my friends on a voice call spent SEVERAL days on this quest and that isn't even a bad thing. But I really struggled with this quest for one reason and one reason alone. (well several reasons but you know). I stink at mazes. I really do, and Block 12 was miserable because of it (oh god don't even get me started on Puzzle 90, even though that wasn't even the most obnoxious puzzle here that honor goes to 68). I even wound up referencing this thread quite a few times when I got stuck, and overall it's the kind of experience that works way better with a team of people working together than it does on your own. That's how I played the other two 100 Words of Wisdom quests and they were a great time.

 

But then we reached what I think, I'm not even sure to be honest, is Puzzle 100, and I'm just like ok where do I even start.

Spoiler

The backrooms part is fine. Honestly I'm not even mad, it fits the theme and isn't as obnoxious as level 12's map was. But when your input method is just four switches I can't help but wonder if I'm putting the solution in wrong, or if something is wrong with how I'm putting it in since the quest isn't clear. I think the puzzle wants me to input the number of each type of floor tile, which would be 12 (or 48 idk), 57, 36, and 48, in that order. Sometimes when I push EX1 though, the switch animation doesn't play, which screws me up because now I can't tell if the game accepted my input properly or not, because the input's just switches instead of the handy 0-9 tiles used earlier. So...yeah, I got frustrated and went here.

Hopefully if this does get seen and responded to it'll help anyone else who stumbles upon these quests.

[Alucard648]

Hopefully if this does get seen and responded to it'll help anyone else who stumbles upon these quests.

Update is waiting for apprival in database.

As for final puzzle:

Spoiler

Order for switches was 11342324 counting from left. And there is 1/2 second cooldown between switch hits. The reason the sound was disabled is because the tester managed to brute-force it. Now I came with idea of making "correct" and "wrong" sounds the same.

[TheLinkToThePast]

Update is waiting for apprival in database.

As for final puzzle:

Spoiler

Order for switches was 11342324 counting from left. And there is 1/2 second cooldown between switch hits. The reason the sound was disabled is because the tester managed to brute-force it. Now I came with idea of making "correct" and "wrong" sounds the same.

First: Thanks for responding! I'm not going to lie, I wasn't expecting one. Secondly: ...I'm sorry I have to know the logic. I appreciate that you gave the answer, but I'm curious now why that's the answer. Can you enlighten me?