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Gauging interest in a Classic quest based off of AlttP


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Would you play a simplified version of ALttP made in Classic?

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#31 ywkls

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Posted 03 May 2016 - 06:53 PM

.If anyone has any ideas, lemme know. 

 

Basically, one would be an item that is an actual wand and the other would just look like one (probably even have a different equipment slot) and through a fairly simple item script, interact with the portals you mentioned and harm enemies.

 

Overall, it sounds like you've thought everything through fairly well. (Probably better than I did whenever I tried to remake LTTP without scripts.) I might be interested in contributing some scripting to this, once you get things up and running.


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#32 Binx

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Posted 03 May 2016 - 11:30 PM

As a random note, there's actually a chinese bootleg called Triforce of God that is a straight-up 8-bit demake of ALttP. It's..... A bit buggy, and they shrunk down the dungeons, a lot.


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#33 Lüt

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Posted 04 May 2016 - 08:04 AM

Inside a Giant Whale, for no reason:

I absolutely love your thought process on this quest.

EDIT 10^6 x 1.24: Who's on board for putting Zelda in a bottle when you meet her in the castle dungeon instead of having her follow you? Long story short, I'm not using a NPC follow script, so this is gonna happen via dialogue. :D

Best treatment of a princess ever.

About the overworld. I have decided against using a straight up 16x16 screen grid. [...] Some areas look really, really off this way. Also, worth noting, AlttP uses three more tiles of height on each screen.

I think that's a good idea. Most of the screens would look awkwardly squashed if you attempted a direct translation. It's not that they couldn't look nice on their own, but since people will inevitably be comparing them to LttP, that point of reference will undermine what would otherwise be considered good screens.

What you said later, about using LttP as a base, is easily the best idea. The map screens you posted are a good example of what I consider doing it The Right Way™ - implementing your own design elements into a similar overall structure. For example, the pond in the lower left of the desert. Variations like that are what would keep a project like this fresh but familiar.

I apologize for the huge images, and questionable.. ahem, quality of this sketch :heh:

You don't seriously sketch on a chalkboard, do you?  :eyebrow:

I am going to be using Moosh's Instrumentality set, instead of the unreleased custom set I made a few years ago. The main reason is, I really like the new palettes in Moosh's set, and I can still add in my custom tiles, and FFA/3 shit from my other set quite easily (Rydia, and Joe123 made the FF3/ FFA sets respectively). This will make for the ultimate 'unholy fusion of Classic and a bunch of others'! Instrumentality also has a lot of other tiles that I would have liked to add on my own, namely the GB tiles, which, ask me if I give a fuck about clashing. Cause I don't #yolo #blind #whocaresaboutoutlines

Instrumentality looks like it would be a good start for a project like this.

Which of the GB tiles are you using though? If it's for multi-tier dungeons, check out the Diagonal / First-Tier-Down tile packs by Lightwulf.

And if you need to go even deeper, I've been making my own Second-Tier-Down tiles as well, plus expansions to his originals for extra matching capacity/variety. I suppose I could pass some on, if those are the kind of tiles you're looking for.

Link will obtain the Master Sword. I should explain how I want to set up swords. The first sword (wooden in ZC, white in LttP) will stab, and not shoot sword beams. The Master sword will slash, and shoot half power sword beams. I'm thinking of having the Golden sword always shoot sword beams, and the tempered sword also give you the peril scroll. This is subject to change though, cause I like slashing. I think it would make the player feel like they really became more powerful with this legendary sword though, if it had such a dramatic improvement over the first sword.

I like this setup. Admittedly, I've grown used to slash over the last year, but I went without it for some 20 years before it ever made its way into my ZC games, so I have no problem going without it, especially if only for a while. Even if some people prefer it from the start, I agree that it would feel more rewarding to get it when you pick up the Master Sword. Consider some of the discussions people have had regarding multiple difficulty levels in quests: the most common opinion is that mere HP/Damage stat changes are the laziest method of implementation, while varying monster rosters/attack abilities/item techniques are the most thorough. Attaching things like the slash technique or Peril Scroll to the swords makes them a lot more worthwhile to obtain than just a sword that provides a mere damage stat increase.


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#34 Anthus

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Posted 05 May 2016 - 10:21 PM

I think I would have liked the original plan better, with an ice rod and such. Still, this sounds very well planned out, and I'm looking forward to seeing the result.

 

Giving/Taking away the book based on what item you have selected sounds pretty doable, and easy to just throw into an existing quest without messing with the script too much.

 

I'd like to have ice magic, but it's something I can live without. I like the idea of just having two wands; two equipment slots, and have one wand disable the magic book when it is being used. That way, the "Sun Rod" works like a normal wand with the book, and the "Moon Rod" is a magic-firing non fire making wand item that disables the book (which Link will likely just have in his inventory from the start, invisibly). One other detail is the two wands would have different magic firing sprites (but I'm perfectly okay of this just being a palette swap), but I -think- you can do this in editor without scripting. I have to check again though since I haven't messed with the item editor in months.

 

EDIT: Hm, there is the triggering the two different wand triggers. One could be an FFC trigger that only works with that wand item ID, again, no real scripting expertise here :D

 

Basically, one would be an item that is an actual wand and the other would just look like one (probably even have a different equipment slot) and through a fairly simple item script, interact with the portals you mentioned and harm enemies.

 

Overall, it sounds like you've thought everything through fairly well. (Probably better than I did whenever I tried to remake LTTP without scripts.) I might be interested in contributing some scripting to this, once you get things up and running.

 

Yeah, I think it could be an easy thing to script (but I really have no idea). There are a few scripts I'm willing to use but this won't be anything too crazy. It will still be a Classic styled quest at heart.

 

I appreciate the offer too, I will probably be looking for some scripting help, even if it is just having someone help me combine global scripts, if I can't figure it out. Most of the scripting for this project will be pre-made FFC scripts, and maybe two, or three globals, if they work together nicely. I need to get serious about building "The engine" of this project though. I have a lot of event based simple scripts that I had people make for me too, in the past, like one where you can step on a combo with an item to trigger secrets (three pendants-> warp to get Master Sword scene), and one where sounds play, and other little cosmetic/ "simple" stuff.

 

As a random note, there's actually a chinese bootleg called Triforce of God that is a straight-up 8-bit demake of ALttP. It's..... A bit buggy, and they shrunk down the dungeons, a lot.

 

Oh yeah, I actually found a ROM of that thing, and played some it it, and ripped some tiles from it. That project was my first 'attempt' at doing a NES demake, but the tiles are limited, and actually pretty ugly.That project became Link's Hangover, which can be found in my signature, if you are interested in seeing those tiles in action.

 

You don't seriously sketch on a chalkboard, do you?  :eyebrow:

 

Lol, no, that's actually a sketch book page, that I scanned, and inverted the color on. I thought is looked easier to see, I guess :P It does look like a chalkboard, which might not be a bad idea.. that, or a dry-erase board. I do most of my drawings on printed "ZC graph" paper now though, that one is pretty old.

 

Which of the GB tiles are you using though? If it's for multi-tier dungeons, check out the Diagonal / First-Tier-Down tile packs by Lightwulf.

And if you need to go even deeper, I've been making my own Second-Tier-Down tiles as well, plus expansions to his originals for extra matching capacity/variety. I suppose I could pass some on, if those are the kind of tiles you're looking for.

 

Those are cool, but I don't think I'd be using diagonals. Mostly cause ZC lacks true diagonal collision, and also cause it feels kind of clunky with 8-way walking, sometimes. I will probably be designing most of the dungeons kind of like GB dungeons, which are basically smaller LttP dungeons.

 

I like this setup. Admittedly, I've grown used to slash over the last year, but I went without it for some 20 years before it ever made its way into my ZC games, so I have no problem going without it, especially if only for a while. Even if some people prefer it from the start, I agree that it would feel more rewarding to get it when you pick up the Master Sword. Consider some of the discussions people have had regarding multiple difficulty levels in quests: the most common opinion is that mere HP/Damage stat changes are the laziest method of implementation, while varying monster rosters/attack abilities/item techniques are the most thorough. Attaching things like the slash technique or Peril Scroll to the swords makes them a lot more worthwhile to obtain than just a sword that provides a mere damage stat increase.

 

Difficulty settings are a growing trend in ZC quests, but this quest probably won't have anything that complex. It will not be a challenge quest, but it won't be cake walk either. I like having one reasonable difficulty instead of dividing people between "hardcore" and "casual". You either get good enough to beat it as is, or quit. That's my philosophy. Not to say I wouldn't be opposed to having someone help me implement it in an update, if it is something that is wanted if this is finished, and popular enough. It's just not something I'm thinking about now for the project. tl; dr, I'm not doing it right away :P


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#35 Anthus

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Posted 09 May 2016 - 10:29 PM

I've been working on a pretty extensive 'game document'. It's an .odt file, but I need to get serious about organizing. This will also be handy if someone wants to help me out with this in the future if I need help (which I probably, possibly will). It's already pretty long, and covers items, and 'event maps' for cut scenes among otter things. Just the 'bare bones' if already 10 pages. It's basically the outline for the game. I think I'm going to end up breaking it into several files, because one document will get long, fast lol.

 

EDIT: At this point, I am deciding on what items will be used, and how. This will decide what I need help with as far as scripts go too. I want to get it narrowed down.



#36 Matthew Bluefox

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Posted 10 May 2016 - 07:00 AM

I wonder if there's gunna be a fire and ice rod. :)



#37 ywkls

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Posted 10 May 2016 - 09:02 AM

It's an .odt file, but I need to get serious about organizing. 

 

I should note here that not everyone who would be willing to help might be able to open an .odt file. The last time I had to, it was necessary to download a special word processor just for that purpose. And when I didn't need it anymore, the stupid thing refused to let itself be deleted.

 

I agree with the idea of creating a master document to cover everything you want to do, however. Usually one of the first things I do is write down everything I want to remember about what I want to create that I've already decided ahead of time so that I can refer back to it later in case that I forget.



#38 Anthus

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Posted 10 May 2016 - 11:35 AM

I wonder if there's gunna be a fire and ice rod. :)

 

As of now, the Fire Rod is in, as pretty much just the book+wand, but I have something different in mind for the Ice Rob, which will combine a regular wand item, and the Moon Pearl funtion.

 

I should note here that not everyone who would be willing to help might be able to open an .odt file. The last time I had to, it was necessary to download a special word processor just for that purpose. And when I didn't need it anymore, the stupid thing refused to let itself be deleted.

 

I agree with the idea of creating a master document to cover everything you want to do, however. Usually one of the first things I do is write down everything I want to remember about what I want to create that I've already decided ahead of time so that I can refer back to it later in case that I forget.

 

Yeah, .odts don't play nice with some word processors. I use Open Office, but it also lets you save files as a .pdf, which pretty much anyone can open, but you can't edit them.



#39 ywkls

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Posted 10 May 2016 - 12:14 PM

Yeah, .odts don't play nice with some word processors. I use Open Office, but it also lets you save files as a .pdf, which pretty much anyone can open, but you can't edit them.

 

I use a freeware word processor (at least I think it's free...) called Kingsoft Office. it's basically a knockoff of Microsoft Office and includes a spreadsheet (Excel) and presentation (Powerpoint?) program as well as the writer (Word) programs. It can open .doc, .rtf, .txt and convert to .pdf but doesn't like .odt.

 

For scripting, I use Notepad++, which processes most written files; even ones with made-up extensions. But it can't process an .odt file. And I really don't like to get a program that I'm not going to use a lot just to be able to read a few files

 

So, yes; I am interested in possibly contributing to this. But unless you were to post the contents of that file either here on the forums or in a PM; I couldn't read it in that format.

 

Whatever you decide to do is up to you, including not involving me at all.

 

Also, this is my 800th post.


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#40 Anthus

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Posted 10 May 2016 - 12:40 PM

Congrats on 800 posts :D

 

I went ahead and took the plunge and made a script request thread, if you want to check it out. Opinions are welcome. 

 

I have solidly decided on using the Sun/ Moon Rod gimmick. It is original (well.... kinda?). It also effectively replaces two other items that would have required getting balls deep in more complex scripts, and set-ups (Moon Pearl, and Magic Mirror are gone, see ya, bye, nope, not in my ZC).



#41 Anthus

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Posted 24 May 2016 - 04:04 PM

What may be the first screen is done. As you may have guessed, this is outside of Link's house.

 

This is the general style of screen design I'm going to be going for, with touches of more Classic design as well (read: slightly less organic in some parts, and more Z1 like). I'm not too keen on the palette yet, or some of the tile choices, but this was made quickly to test the colors. :)

 

e1heTWL.png

 

That house will not be there later. It is a placeholder until I import all of my loose tiles and stuff from my other folders, and projects. I also have some more natural looking path tiles somewhere too. But again, mostly trying to figure out a palette I like here :D

 

I'm not necessarily going for an "NES authentic" palette structure either. I'm taking a more liberal approach to color usage where it look nicer.


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#42 Lüt

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Posted 25 May 2016 - 07:18 AM

It's a good start. The rock walls look surprisingly decent. (As in, they're a closer likeness to the originals than expected.)

 

I was going to say something about fixing the house, but I suppose erasing it entirely is another way of dealing with it :P Though, structurally, I think it's a good fit, as far as layout and walkability goes.

 

As for paths, have you looked at the New Classic Path Tiles pack from Homura? They seem like a decent enough start, if you don't already have something in your loose tiles collection.


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#43 Anthus

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Posted 26 May 2016 - 11:20 AM

Thanks, and yeah, the house tiles were more to test the shape of it, and see how it would fit on the screen. Homura has a nice set of tiles there, but I do have some paths I think I'm going to use from another project. It has diagonals, which are very easy to use in this simple Classic style.

 

Here is another shot, this one shows the 'rainy intro'. It looks really cool when animated, but I can't figure out how to animate stuff in Graphics Gale, and I don't wanna download another program, and learn to use it for one gif, lol. I'm liking the palette a little bit better now too. 

 

2fzABje.png




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