52 replies to this topic

[DarkFlameWolf]

I've always advocated the Lost Isle Build which is a modified version of the 2.11, beta 254 build. Dark Nation specifically modified it for us fixing a lot of bugs that even the current build versions at the time didn't get fixed for many more builds after. So he made sure it was pretty stable before we released both Lost Isle/Origin and the build to play it on.
Here are some of the features that this build has that previously stable released builds may or may not have:
Subscreen Editor
Item Editor
Enemy Editor
Room State Carryovers
FFC Combos
Multiple Warps
Some Scripting Capabilities
and More...
So it has a lot of 'new' features that can benefit quest makers in making their quest more complex and tricked out that previous versions of ZC couldn't. However, there are a few minor bugs that I've found when playing quests on this version:
1) If you don't have the Like Like rule 'doesn't eat small shields' turned on for some quests, if you play some older 1.90 or beta 183+ quests, if a Like Like eats your Magic Shield, it'll eat your normal shield as well leaving you defenseless.
2) Sometimes, if you beat a quest, you do trigger a bug when the quest gets saved after game completion. Your hearts are reduced down to 3 and some key items are randomly removed.
Beyond these two bugs I've noticed. I've played over 30 different quests in the Lost Isle Build ranging from 1.84 quests, 1.90 quests, beta 183/184 quests, even 'some' 2.10/2.11 quests with minimal bugs or faults. Which indicates to me that it is pretty reliable in terms of stability. In fact, it works well in Vista and Windows 7 as I've also experienced. So OS won't be much of a factor here. Now that the Zquest LI Build has been released, people can now even start building quests specifically for this Build.
The reason why I'm suggesting we make this build official? So people don't have to keep download new alphas and builds and making quests for specific versions that everyone must download just to play the quest. Why have 20+ different folders for each individual alpha build just so you can play 20 different quests all made on different builds? It gets unwieldy fast. So while we are waiting for 2.5 to be finished, why not utilize the LI Build as the last good stable release of ZC? I've tested it enough to know that I'm confident enough to play just about any quest in it that's been made prior to build 254.
But what do I know? Its just a suggestion and people want to continue making and playing quests on many builds which ultimately are going to get scrapped anyway once 2.5 is released and you find out your quest can't be played on that. What do you all think? Has anyone had a chance to even work with the build since the release of its Zquest? Any experiences playing quests using the player? What are your thoughts?

[sigtau]

I'm 100% in favor of this being released as 2.5, and the current 2.5 alphas being moved to a new version--ZC 3.0, perhaps?

[Nathaniel]

I myself have played a few 1.92 and 2.10 quests on the Lost Isle build, including some of her quests, Shoelace's Hero of Dreams, and I forget what else. I have yet to experience any crashing, from what I can remember. It seems to work great with quests from those versions. I started doing this after noticing her mentioning it in some of her walkthrough videos. It worked in those, and it worked for me too, being the skeptic that I am. If you don't mind the like-like issue along with the occasional clock from killed enemies (but I find it an extra convenience), it think it certainly better than dealing with certain bugs that are well known in 1.92 and 2.10, such as the midi and maps bugs. The build isn't perfect (but what build is?), but I find it more stable than all others I have come across. I think it is worth being an official build, just from my experiences with it so far. I wouldn't call it 2.5 though (at least not the numbers by itself), as that might cause some confusion, as people might confuse it with some of the recent 2.5 builds. We want to minimize what could easily cause those sorts of issues.

[trudatman]

....The build isn't perfect (but what build is?)...

do you want me to type it?

[DarkFlameWolf]

I agree with Nathaniel, we should not label this as 2.5. Because it isn't. It never will be. It is merely a placeholder stable build inbetween our last one officially released and upcoming 2.5. And trudatman, I have no idea what you're getting at. If you're saying the most recent builds are more stable, that doesn't change the fact that you still have to download specific builds for individual quests. At least the LI Build has two quests going for it and hopefully a third coming from me.

Edited by DarkFlameWolf, 07 August 2010 - 12:31 AM.

[trudatman]

one point nine zero.

[Nathaniel]

Well, the 1.90 argument is a matter of opinion, but does it outweigh all other factors? Depends who you ask. I certainly understand it, though. It still lacks capabilities that later versions have, but the point is certainly taken. Anyway, that isn't the central point of this topic, so I guess we have no need to dive into that further.

[Peteo]

At least the LI Build has two quests going for it and hopefully a third coming from me.

And quite possibly a 4th one from me.

So even though the LI Build is not 100% bugfree, it is still very stable and it seems like no one has experienced any serious problems with it, including me. So I support making this build an official ZC Build.

[DarkFlameWolf]

I don't really know what to say Peteo, I almost half expected you not to support this. The fact that you are astounds me. Thank you.

[Koh]

I support this notion as well. I remember earlier this year, I played Lost Isle in class. After I got lost, I started playing other quests (1.92 to 2.10, and a few early 2.5) in the LI Player, and I've experienced no glitches or crashes. Not even the bugs pointed out above. Koh's vote is in favor , even though he doesn't have his laptop yet to use it.

[Wolfman2000]

It's funny...StepMania is going through a similar time as well. A particular version in between the last known stable and the current source code was picked to be the new version 4, with everything else being sent to version 5.

About version numbers, however...I may as well get something clear. Why is 2.10 the last stable when 2.10 is greater than 2.5? Is it meant to be 2.1 or 2.50? When that is clarified, I can suggest a version number for the Lost Isle build.

...consider me in support for the idea, but only if all OSes are supported.

[trudatman]

counting fail. haven't gotten to decimals in school, yet?

[Nimono]

About version numbers, however...I may as well get something clear. Why is 2.10 the last stable when 2.10 is greater than 2.5? Is it meant to be 2.1 or 2.50? When that is clarified, I can suggest a version number for the Lost Isle build.

you do realize that 2.10 ISN'T greater than 2.5, right? Decimals, dear boy... Here, lemme show you why you're wrong:

2.10 = 2 10/100
2.5 = 2 5/10 = 2 50/100

50 > 10

therefore, 2.5 is > 2.10.

IIRC, 2.5 was originally called 2.50 after they changed it from 2.11.


In any case, I like the proposition of the thread. I agree, make that the next official version. The current 2.5 builds can wait.
But watch people not be satisfied anyways. ;P

[Plissken]

Where would that leave all of us working in the newer 2.5 builds praying for a release? Sure, we'd have one, but nothing compatible with the games we've been working on for way too long. Honestly we should set a date within the next two months and slap a release sign on a build at that point. If there's any game breaking bugs, put a 2.5.1 out. We can handle minor bugs, we did with 2.10. We should release LI build as a players release, not a builders.

[Mitchfork]

Actually Wolfman2000 is correct, program version numbering typically ignores decimal conventions (i.e. 6.10 is the version after 6.9, even though fractionally it wouldn't make sense. You're supposed to read it as "sixth version, tenth revision").

I've always wondered the same thing about 2.5 in the back of my mind.

EDIT: Also I agree with Plissken. The current build is stable enough. Make it the alpha for a final 2.5 release, instead of basically going years into the past for the LI build.