29 replies to this topic

[Linkdude]

I think that there should be the ability to add exp to your game. THis way, you don't have to search the entire game for all the Heart Pieces, you can just train! This was just a thought that came to me, and I thought it would be pretty cool...


Something went wrong with the poll, sorry. Can't edit it for some reason...

Edited by Linkdude, 08 May 2008 - 07:40 PM.

[Snarwin]

Honestly, I think most people would rather search for heart pieces that grind levels. Heck, having to level grind in a game is usually considered a design flaw; I can't think of any reason you'd want to add it intentionally.

If, however, you really want your quest to have an experience system, you can use one of the 2.5 alpha builds and script one yourself.

[Nathaniel]

/me hits Linkdude for committing two sins:

1. Putting the topic in the wrong forum.
2. Creating a silly one choice poll, even though it was apparently accidental.

Exaggeration, of course. I will move it to General ZC Discussion and simply poke fun at your poll, but it's all good. No big whoop.

As for building it into the ZC code, an experience system would likely be too much trouble for what it is worth, especially considering it takes long enough to fix bugs themselves. But if it can be scripted, then hey, why not? It isn't that bad of an idea to try to script, considering that the Adventure of Link had something of that nature.

[Feenicks]

Didn't Gleeok make an RPG script that was at the AGN expo?
But I agree - finding heart container pieces is a lot more fun than grinding. When I want to grind for experience points I play RPGs. And most of the time these days I don't want to grind for experience points. When does endlessly slaying monsters help increase your skill anyway (and it doesn't help that bosses starting in FFV stopped giving you any experience or gil)?

[Radien]

I think it'd be nice, but sort of a distraction from the main purpose of ZC. Contrary to appearances, RPG systems are really hard to design. This is doubly true when the program has no inherent character stats set up. (And for the love of God don't tell me items count as "stats"...they don't work the same way. Just ask a ZC developer.)

I think a simpler step would be to make money that is automatically added to your wallet without appearing on-screen, and assigning solid amounts to each enemy. This could create the potential for a pseudo-RPG system without totally dismantling ZC's existing system. Either way, though, I don't want to see it until most of the current bugs are killed...

Honestly, I think most people would rather search for heart pieces that grind levels. Heck, having to level grind in a game is usually considered a design flaw; I can't think of any reason you'd want to add it intentionally.

I disagree. Castlevania became a LOT better after they added RPG elements in Symphony of the Night.

Like any game element, it can be done badly, or inexpertly used as a band-aid for other elements. But it's not the purity of the genre that's at fault. There are times when action elements are used as a band-aid for RPG elements, so really, it goes both ways.

...For the record, however, there aren't enough action/adventure games out there, but there are hundreds of action/RPGs, just because they sell well. This is why I must get my Zelda fix regularly.

[Linkdude]

Um, ok. I want to start with this.

Nathaniel-I did put this in General ZC Discussion, it must have just popped up wrong place.

Anyways, I never said it would be a requirements, just saying that maybe you could be able to turn it on/off in options.

Snarwin-I completely disagree. While it is great to have a challenge every now and again, sometimes people want a break from the basic mumbo-jumbo. You know, kill Ganon, save Zelda, get Heart Pieces, beat bosses... It gets boring after a while. And who knows? Maybe you could have Heart Pieces AND the training idea. It could be the future of ZC you know!

[Plissken]

Nathaniel-I did put this in General ZC Discussion, it must have just popped up wrong place.

Well, you put it in General Discussion, but not General ZC Discussion. They don't just simply 'pop' up in the wrong place. Don't worry about it, he's just kidding around, it happens all the time.

[jman2050]

I added a scripting system for a reason you know.

[Bayta]

Exactly, so people could stop annoying the devs to put in all these new features (and, at first, I thought it would help quicken up 2.5's release, but obviously not ). Anyway, on the subject of an exp system... Well, why bother with it? It really isn't that useful, in my opinion.

[Snarwin]

I disagree. Castlevania became a LOT better after they added RPG elements in Symphony of the Night.

Like any game element, it can be done badly, or inexpertly used as a band-aid for other elements. But it's not the purity of the genre that's at fault. There are times when action elements are used as a band-aid for RPG elements, so really, it goes both ways.

Oh, I'm not saying that RPG elements are inherently bad game design. I've played, and enjoyed, my fair share of RPGs. Leveling up and level grinding, however, are two entirely separate things. If you have to walk back and forth for half an hour fighting enemies until you're strong enough to take on the next boss, something's gone wrong.

I suppose it would be possible to make a quest with RPG elements work, but it would be extremely difficult to balance, especially since, as you pointed out, ZC doesn't really have anything analagous to stats. Which brings us back to the original question: sure, you can, but why would you want to?

Snarwin-I completely disagree. While it is great to have a challenge every now and again, sometimes people want a break from the basic mumbo-jumbo. You know, kill Ganon, save Zelda, get Heart Pieces, beat bosses... It gets boring after a while.

Not as boring as a terribly balanced RPG, I assure you. Try playing Adventure of Link sometime; you'll see what I mean.

[LostInHyru1e]

ZC isn't made for RPGs. We have RPG Maker and Game Maker for that. Doing it in ZC is probably very hard.

[Schwa]

Exp. Points in Zelda? I think it's a great idea... kinda. The way I'd do it wouldn't require any scripting at all. This is what I'd do: Edit the Heart item to be in the Heart Piece category, but set the Pickup/Counter info to still give you a Heart when collected. It would also just be worth a Heart Piece. Then I'd go to Init Data and change the Heart Pieces needed to some ridiculously high number such as 80 or 100. Now, every 80-100 normal Hearts you pick up, you "level up" and your HP increases.

Perhaps a Global Script could be utilized to increase the amount of Heart Pieces needed for a Heart Container every time Link "levels up"... At the very least it would be a series of "If->then->else" commands while caught in a Waitframe/While Loop, but I totally see it working, and I think it's a marvelous idea, unlike SOME people...

Oh. Another alternative to the "exp. curve script" is to start it out on some ultimate number like 999 (or 256 if that's the highest it can go), start Link out with that number minus a small value (so if it's 999 Link can start out with 949, making the difference only 50), and set the Heart item to have a Pickup Script so whenever the amount of Heart Pieces Link has is 0, it sets it to 949 minus 25 for each Heart Container Link has gained. Bingo, instant learning curve. Funny thing is I even have the code worked out in my head for something like that to work... I think I'm going to try and script it even.

Thanks for the awesome idea! I'll let you know if this works so you can use it too once the script is perfect.

[Alestance]

I'd still think scripting is the way to go for this, especially if you want to add strength and defense to the categories.

I was thinking. Perhaps XP gained could be calculated by items picked up from monsters.

A heart would be 5 xp

A green rupee(flashing rupee) would be 3 xp

Blue rupee: 7 xp

10-rupee: 10 xp

bombs: 15 xp

Small Jar: 3xp

Large Jar: 7xp

and levels would give more xp, like perhaps 20% more for what level in the game it is.(level one's bombs would give 18 xp, while level 9's bombs would give 42 xp, while level 255's bombs would give 780 xp)

And each level you have the choice of increasing your attack, or defense, which is augmented by what sword you have, or what armor you have.) Max level for each would be a healthy 25. And ffor each level in Attack, you can learn a new skill, or gain a new ability which involves it( such as Spin Attack at level 5, and Hurricane Spin at 15.)

Level Grinding wouldn't be worth it on the overworld, unless you're fighting one Ghini One and swarms of Ghini twos.(Graveyard)

Edited by Alestance, 09 May 2008 - 07:19 AM.

[Majora]

Not as boring as a terribly balanced RPG, I assure you. Try playing Adventure of Link sometime; you'll see what I mean.

I've replayed AoL lots of times and it never got boring. Hell, I used to train by New/Hidden Kasuto until I got enough lives to tackle the Great Palace (I made it to D lives once )

[Schwa]

I tried my idea, and it works except for the script... because item scripts are broken in the current build...

Ah wells, just saying it works somewhat. With the hearts as heart pieces. But you don't need to set the Heart Pieces needed to 80... Something like 20 or 30 is fine, because to be honest, Link doesn't find that many hearts. At least not if there are no Bush/Flower/Grass/Slash->Item combos in the game. :o