87 replies to this topic

[Binx]

How are you doing that, then? Because I have the editor open right now and there are no options for an overlay. Tried setting it to CSet 0 slot 1, still just shows a black background.

 

EDIT: Oh, wait, there's a transparency color in the sys. color palette. Guess I should have paid closer attention.

 

More Edit: Still think I wanna draw the DMap title. It still looks ugly having the title above the map in 2 lines.

Edited by Binx, 18 May 2015 - 03:57 PM.

[Timelord]

ya, no way to make it transparent with the vanilla subscreen editor

 

http://i.imgur.com/OLAieBj.png

 

Fantastic. Would you care to share what flags you set to accomplish that, or is it simply that the subscreen editor doesn't render it transparent (background colour), while the game does?

[Binx]

Fantastic. Would you care to share what flags you set to accomplish that, or is it simply that the subscreen editor doesn't render it transparent (background colour), while the game does?

It's under the "Sys. Color" palette. I never noticed it before, either.

[Timelord]

It's under the "Sys. Color" palette. I never noticed it before, either.

 

Are you serious!?

 

I'll give you an anecdote:

 

I was specifically told never to use 'system colours' for counters, because they can change if extra palette bosses are on-screen. I originally had a nice teal system colour, for my MP gauge, and it would turn black, and stay black, if a Gleeok, or BS Dodongo, or other enemies were on-screen. I think it was a bug, ans I clearly remember discussing it here, on PZC, with Saffith, so I never looked in that selection again.

 

Not that it'll ultimately matter, in my case, but that's still a very strange place to put it, especially given that there is already a transparent colour value in the palette, and that one doesn't work.

 

P.S. ..and it was indeed...

 

I don't know if this was ever fixed, patched, or remedied.

Edited by ZoriaRPG, 18 May 2015 - 04:31 PM.

[Binx]

So, I think I've settled on doing it like this:

 

L Open Menu

R: Open Map

EX1: Jump

EX2: Interact

A: Primary Weapon

B: Secondary item or skill

 

I'll be drawing the actual save name where it says "-SAVENAME-" Too lazy to do it right this second.

 

EDIT: May also replace the food counters with a character portrait or something, not sure what, though; since it's redundant to have the counters there AND over the "B" button when those items are selected.

Edited by Binx, 26 May 2015 - 12:36 AM.

[Timelord]

Name is used to define (or remind us of) the character in use, out of similar looking characters with different stats?

If not, region name, or present objective might be more useful there.

Otherwise, people will only be staring at their quest .sav token at all times, which doesn't really serve a purpose there.

It does look quite nice now, and the buttons are far clearer.

Edited by ZoriaRPG, 26 May 2015 - 07:10 AM.

[MoscowModder]

Using player's save names can be kinda clever, but most people (read: me) use save names to tell ourselves what quest this is, rather than set the name we want to be called. Unless you let people know in your quest description that your save name is significant.

[Binx]

Name is used to define (or remind us of) the character in use, out of similar looking characters with different stats?

If not, region name, or present objective might be more useful there.

Otherwise, people will only be staring at their quest .sav token at all times, which doesn't really serve a purpose there.

It does look quite nice now, and the buttons are far clearer.

 
Well, there's only one character, so it's probably a bit redundant to have the name on the HUD. Not to mention that the save name is going to be in the menu, as well,like in this mock up (May end up abandoning the custom fonts, since Small Prop is about as generic as you can get, and my own font came out much larger):
 

Main Menu

Items:  // Brings up Item Subscreen, Uses Font Set 2, CSet 11
Skills/Abilities:  //Brings up Skills and Abilities subscreen, Uses Font Set 2, CSet 11
@savename(): //Brings up Character Subscreen, Uses Font Set 1, CSet 6 (so its color will always match the color of the player, regardless of class, like I did with the book and eye icons above)
Quests: //Opens the current quests subscreen. Uses Font Set 2, CSet 11
Quit: //Exits menu, Uses Font Set 2, CSet 11
 

(Awwww, it removed the pretty table I made in Word... Oh well.)
As you can see, there's a quest subscreen, as well, so there's no reason to have "current objective" on the HUD, and the "Minimap Title" element is still a problem, size-wise, so basically, my main issue is having no idea what to place in that space that would actually be useful.

 

 

Using player's save names can be kinda clever, but most people (read: me) use save names to tell ourselves what quest this is, rather than set the name we want to be called. Unless you let people know in your quest description that your save name is significant.

Well, yeah, that's kind of a given.


I think the biggest problem I have is what to put in that center space, since there's really nothing going on the HUD that I need, rather than what's there. I'd like to use a minimap, but it doesn't fit, so I'm just gonna settle for hopefully figuring out how to get a multi-stage map (like, you hit "R" once to open a small, transparent minimap in the bottom right corner, then again to open the full map subscreen, then again to close it). Like I said, most counters are redundant, and there's only enough space for 3 or maybe 4, and those items can be kept track of easier and better in other menus (Keys on the Map subscreen, money on the @savename subscreen, consumables on the items subscreen, etc) The character name and portrait are also redundant, since they'll also be in the Character menu, as will be alignment (if I choose to add morality-based decision-making, still debating it, since it will be a pain to implement). So, yeah, without SOMETHING there, though, I've got this big gap in the middle of the subscreen with nothing there. Character portrait and name just seemed like the best decorative piece.

[Timelord]

Perhaps, you could move 'Level' to that space? It'd be a bit cleaner, especially given that your level indicator is a numeral, and not a gauge.

That would give you a pixel or two of space, to put between the gauges, so that you can centre them between the upper, and lower, green lines.

The current position of 'Level' makes it harder to notice than it could be; as it's sort of crammed at the bottom of a gauge; and looks as if another bar should be under it.

If you're against that, and you have a day/night system, you could put a graphic there to symbolise how far through a day, or a night the cycle has come (e.g. a moon, and sun, with a pointer between them). It's decoration, but could be useful.

For the record, having the mission objective, if there are many objectives, at a glance, is never superfluous.

Edited by ZoriaRPG, 26 May 2015 - 08:16 PM.

[Binx]

Some additional menu/subscreen mockups: Character Subscreen, Main Menu and Transparent Minimap

EDIT: Yeah, moving the Level indicator's probably a good idea.

Edited by Binx, 26 May 2015 - 08:26 PM.

[Timelord]

Some additional menu/subscreen mockups: Character Subscreen, Main Menu and Transparent Minimap
EDIT: Yeah, moving the Level indicator's probably a good idea.

One important note: You should probably present stats int he same format that AD&D has done since time immemorial:

Strength, Dexterity, Fortitude, Intelligence, Wisdom, Charisma

That's hpw the average P&P player is used to seeing them.

My D20 system, has eight primary stats, and each has two sub-statistics. Checks are always based off single, or combined sub-statistics.

Strength
	Muscle -> Represented as 'Muscle' in 'LoE'
	Stamina
Dexterity
	Agility
	Balance
Constitution --> Represented as 'Body' in 'LoE'
	Health
	Fitness
Mobility
	Speed
	Movement
Intelligence -> Represented as 'Mind' in 'LoE'
	Knowledge
	Reasoning
Wisdom
	Intuition
	Willpower
Charisma
	Influence -> Represented as 'Influence' in 'LoE'
	Physical Beauty
Fea
	Soul
	Luck - > Represented as 'Luck' in 'LoE'

This allows a level of fineness, and separates stats into two blocks of four, for physical, and non-physical attributes.

As to the active subscreen, I think you'll need to work out some of that jarring black space, by aligning things up a but more. The gap between the passive display, and the content of the active display could probably be effectively streamlined.

I'd also make the alignment gauge, a pointer, rather than a bar. Put an indicator at the axis points, rather than 'filling' up a gauge. At present it looks as if Lawful Good is the ultimate goal, rather than a strict indication...


At the least, stats of the body, and stats of the mind, should be grouped.

[Binx]

Oh, that's not the actual active subscreen. It's just a mockup to give myself visuals on how I'm going to draw them. I won't actually be using the normal active subscreen. The menus won't be appearing in the same locations as on the screen, there, and all that extra black space will be transparent, and the passive's gonna stay up top. As far as the stats go, they're not traditional AD&D stats, actually, in anything but name. There will be a rundown at the start of the quest explaining the various buttons and subscreen elements. As far as what they currently do: Fortitude sets the HP (not sure if I'll be doing bonuses, or if I'll just make it a straight translation, as it is currently), Wisdom sets MP, Stamina sets the base SP (Stamina points) of your character, Strength determines damage bonus for melee weapons (except dual sword), Dexterity determines damage bonus for ranged weapons (and dual swords) Intellect determines the damage bonus for magical attacks and charisma determines a damage bonus for performance-based skills. Each of the damage stats will have a second use, once I figure out what they are, beyond charisma making you more likeable, and making items cheaper. Not doing weight capacities, because that annoys the hell out of me.

 

 

EDIT: And, really, if anyone gets that annoyed over the order of stats in my game, they can go right to hell. At least my stats still make sense, given the grouping of Damage-based and Meter-based stats.

 

EDIT AGAIN: Oh, yeah, the actual meter's going to be a little different.it's actually going to have two meters each extending from the center of the gauge,but your maximum "points" if you will, will be exactly half a gauge, so each "Lawful"decision will counteract a "chaotic"decision (assuming both decisions give equal points), and you'll start with 25 points in each, true neutral. So, you start the game, and you encounter a thief, who's stealing to feed her family and you choose to arrest her, but plead for clemency and pay the damages for her, you gain one point in both law and good, so your new total is 26/24 in the favor of law and 26/24 in the favor of good. I'll have to work out the exact totals (because 100 doesn't divide evenly by 6), but basically the idea is that between the two gauges, it should cover all possible alignments.

Edited by Binx, 26 May 2015 - 09:25 PM.

[Timelord]

Oh, that's not the actual active subscreen. It's just a mockup to give myself visuals on how I'm going to draw them. I won't actually be using the normal active subscreen. The menus won't be appearing in the same locations as on the screen, there, and all that extra black space will be transparent, and the passive's gonna stay up top. As far as the stats go, they're not traditional AD&D stats, actually, in anything but name. There will be a rundown at the start of the quest explaining the various buttons and subscreen elements. As far as what they currently do: Fortitude sets the HP (not sure if I'll be doing bonuses, or if I'll just make it a straight translation, as it is currently), Wisdom sets MP, Stamina sets the base SP (Stamina points) of your character, Strength determines damage bonus for melee weapons (except dual sword), Dexterity determines damage bonus for ranged weapons (and dual swords) Intellect determines the damage bonus for magical attacks and charisma determines a damage bonus for performance-based skills. Each of the damage stats will have a second use, once I figure out what they are, beyond charisma making you more likeable, and making items cheaper. Not doing weight capacities, because that annoys the hell out of me.
 
 
EDIT: And, really, if anyone gets that annoyed over the order of stats in my game, they can go right to hell. At least my stats still make sense, given the grouping of Damage-based and Meter-based stats.
 
EDIT AGAIN: Oh, yeah, the actual meter's going to be a little different.it's actually going to have two meters each extending from the center of the gauge,but your maximum "points" if you will, will be exactly half a gauge, so each "Lawful"decision will counteract a "chaotic"decision (assuming both decisions give equal points), and you'll start with 25 points in each, true neutral. So, you start the game, and you encounter a thief, who's stealing to feed her family and you choose to arrest her, but plead for clemency and pay the damages for her, you gain one point in both law and good, so your new total is 26/24 in the favor of law and 26/24 in the favor of good. I'll have to work out the exact totals (because 100 doesn't divide evenly by 6), but basically the idea is that between the two gauges, it should cover all possible alignments.

You forgot 'Luck', because every RPG needs a stat that does nothing obvious.

(I actually make use of the Luck stat in the P&P game extensively. The initial severity of any given encounter, other than plot-point encounters, is affected by chance rolls; and the Luck stat changes what values grant a generally positive, or a generally negative init. Too complex to explain here, probably. It also does things with certain skills, but in the LoE game, it's probably far more limited, and there primarily as a reference to every JRPG ever conceived, having a 'Luck' stat that was there for decoration.)

[Binx]

You forgot 'Luck', because every RPG needs a stat that does nothing obvious.

(I actually make use of the Luck stat in the P&P game extensively. The initial severity of any given encounter, other than plot-point encounters, is affected by chance rolls; and the Luck stat changes what values grant a generally positive, or a generally negative init. Too complex to explain here, probably. It also does things with certain skills, but in the LoE game, it's probably far more limited, and there primarily as a reference to every JRPG ever conceived, having a 'Luck' stat that was there for decoration.)

Actually, "Luck" may be a worthwhile stat. It could affect critical chance and which items are dropped by enemies... Hmmmm...

[Timelord]

Actually, "Luck" may be a worthwhile stat. It could affect critical chance and which items are dropped by enemies... Hmmmm...

I was planning on having it modify some skills, the chance of success for good drops, and the chance of certain other RNG being in player favour. I'm really not planning to do crits in the game; although I'll probably include a framework for them in RPG.zh, along with the demo quests for that, once it's in beta phase.