32 replies to this topic

[)-( Marchland Malady )-(]

I have played many Zelda Classic quests and am finding the standard nine-level tradition to be getting dull. So I think it would be neat to have more than one dungeon per level instead of just one. Connecting dungeons together with passages would also be a good idea. You could even break up a dungeon into parts and have one part be with level one and another part be with level 8.

Let's say, for example, that you are in this water dungeon and you find that you need to get the flippers. A tablet could tell you so and give you the key to where the flippers can be found. Let us say that the flippers are inside a dungeon that you don't get to explore much until very late in the game. The player would have to go inside and go through a small number of rooms to get to the flippers, all the while avoiding powerful monsters and just making a run for it (you would have to fight the monsters much later in the game to beat the dungeon, but you could also be much stronger by then.)

Another example would be to have the player go back to the first dungeon in the game to find a route into a much later one (until a certain item is aquired in the later dungeon, the passage is the only way in and out.) Don't hesitate to give a dungeon more than one entrance, including a way in and out that leads to another one.

The ideas mentioned here could add a lot to a quest based on time travel. Be unique! Don't be generic!

[Jared]

Sounds like a great idea!
I was actually thinking of something close to this. Since the player will be getting the Roc's Feather in the first dungeon, and the dungeon is on a mountain, with a river, maybe I could do other things!
Like a small water temple that leads underground to a lava-filled dungeon, that brings me back to the Roc Dungeon, and then back!
Seems pretty cool, like a "weave" technique!

[SpacemanDan]

I like the sound of this idea, and I was actually going to implement something similar in my own quest a long while back. Basically, the player if they were skilled enough would be able to take a route that lead them through all the dungeons via passages between them and to the end of the game without requiring any items. It would mean that the final boss would be really difficult, but it could be a fun challenge. Not only that, but pulling it off wouldn't be easy either since it means venturing into the later parts of the games with minimal equipment.

I think I may implement this idea into my more recent stuff...Hm...

Fun idea though. Could shake this up a bit and make things more interesting.

[Radien]

Well, "one dungeon" is a rather arbitrary verbal division if they are connected. What I'm saying is that if two "dungeons" are connected as one level, and you need to traverse both dungeons to finish the "level," they are arguably just one dungeon.

Now, it's possible to incorporate multiple themes into the same "level." Look at the Goron Mines in Twilight Princess. That dungeon has both lava areas and water areas. And Spirit Tracks has an ice dungeon that toys with the fire juxtaposition: in addition to having lots of torches, and requiring you to use both ice and fire, the boss uses a combination of ice and fire elements.

As for the idea of connecting ALL the dungeons, there's a game I've played that did that: Megaman Legends 1. The entire series of dungeons exists as a network of underground passageways beneath the city. Although you have to do them in order, and there ARE separations, once they have been completed you will find ways to traverse between dungeons without coming back up to the surface. Also, the underground network gives you numerous ways to pop up at the surface in unexpected locations. MML1 was not, by far, a perfect action/adventure game, but that was a neat innovation. (Megaman Legends 2 did not attempt to do the same thing since it involved lots of island-hopping.)

[)-( Marchland Malady )-(]

I think it would be nice to see a little bit of Metroid-like exploration in a Zelda Classic quest. Even separated parts of the overworld could be part of a dungeon. Suppose that when you get to a screen you find an important item sitting in a small ring of rocks (or even something like a triforce piece.) When you try to get to it from the outside, you find that you can't. Instead, you must find a way to get to the item from below. On a screen next to you, you find a dungeon entrance. The dungeon is how you get to the item.

Have you thought about having a part of the overworld being accessed the first time by a dungeon only? You could then have the player open up a route from within to connect that part of the overworld with the rest of it. Maybe that is the only reason to go through the dungeon the first time, so maybe you could have a boss guarding the exit to the previously unreachable part of the overworld as well as another one guarding the triforce (or something similar.)

When doing the unorthodox ideas I mentioned in this topic, you might want to consider giving the player an idea of what they must do. Massive ruins are best explored with a guide to keep from getting hopelessly lost!

[Shane]

Another idea that could brake the typical Zelda dungeon is a boss in the middle of the dungeon no, not the mini-boss but the boss. After it's defeated you are required to do the second half. Through I won't be using any of these ideas mentioned in the thread as I like to stand close with the typical Zelda dungeons while having fun, being creative and original.

Hopefully this inspirational thread inspires many that changes his or her Zquest experience - it certainly did for me .

[Radien]

Another idea that could brake the typical Zelda dungeon is a boss in the middle of the dungeon no, not the mini-boss but the boss. After it's defeated you are required to do the second half. Through I won't be using any of these ideas mentioned in the thread as I like to stand close with the typical Zelda dungeons while having fun, being creative and original.

Hopefully this inspirational thread inspires many that changes his or her Zquest experience - it certainly did for me .

Or you could take that one step further and have the boss be the FIRST thing you encounter. Defeating it would open up the dungeon for you to explore.

I've seen this done in an RPG, and it worked well. It shook things up a bit and made it more exciting. Try to make it unexpected so the player starts to sweat a little. Then to follow it up, put some difficult puzzles in the dungeon, but don't make any of the later battles harder than the initial boss.

[Shane]

Or you could take that one step further and have the boss be the FIRST thing you encounter. Defeating it would open up the dungeon for you to explore.

Actually considering making my Earth Temple's boss recurring throughout the temple. That would be a fun and original gimmick in witch I hopes of .

I've seen this done in an RPG, and it worked well. It shook things up a bit and made it more exciting. Try to make it unexpected so the player starts to sweat a little. Then to follow it up, put some difficult puzzles in the dungeon, but don't make any of the later battles harder than the initial boss.

Yeah it was done quite excellent. Kudos to them .

--

Also Nolornbon, I thinking of putting my Fire Temple into a mini-dungeon (Death Mt. Creator.) I'll applaud you for giving us
such inspirational words from the day I silently met you.

[)-( Marchland Malady )-(]

My main reason for posting on this site, Midnight_King, is to breathe new life into the Zelda Classic fanbase and thus hope to raise the quality and uniqueness of future quests. I just wish my artistic skills could do the same. I want to be certain that I can get at least three stars out of a loose tile submission before I upload any in the future. Are there tutorials on color choice and shading in the PureZC forums? Robin and Alestance complain that my loose tiles are too pillow-shaded.

Radien's idea of having the boss as the first thing you encounter in a dungeon could be very useful and add a good deal of originality. This could be the case for a palace guarded by a powerful monster. Also good for defending a dungeon that connects to several other ones. Have any of you ever played Might and Magic VII? Some of the dungeons in that game are connected to other ones. The Barrow dungeon is actually several mini-dungeons connected together by teleporters. There is also one dungeon that can only be reached by two other dungeons.

When thinking of what would be neat to see in a Zelda Classic quest, I thought of a large dungeon that existed solely for the purpose of reaching parts of the overworld. I also thought it would be nice to have a level 8 (or a dungeon part of that level in the case of this topic) entered only through that place. There was a quest submitted to the Zelda Classic website (where you find the completed versions of Zelda Classic) that didn't have any dungeons. Instead, there were just overworld areas. That is a trend I would rather not see becoming popular. Underground mazes and surface structures are some of the most interesting places to explore! The ideas in this topic can make them more so!

[Jared]

Or you could take that one step further and have the boss be the FIRST thing you encounter. Defeating it would open up the dungeon for you to explore.

This the best idea ever!!!
A cheap Zelda 1 miniboss in the beginning, then the level opens to the custom minibosses and main bosses, I LOVE it!!
And i'm gonna do it!

Edited by Lynker, 18 May 2011 - 07:35 PM.

[Lightwulf]

You know, it's kind of funny. I just found this thread and some of the ideas contained here I either already put or already planned to put in my quest! Of course, there are so many ideas presented that I found a few I'm thinking of using.

For example, one of my dungeons is located on an island that can only be reached by traveling by ship to get to because the beach is blocked. I am making a way for Link to unblock the beach so he can swim to access the island later. (If you're wondering how I'm making the ship, it's not like the Final Fantasy games or by using scripts. I haven't announced my quest yet, but watch for it soon.)

A while ago, early on in creating my quest, I came up with that idea of connecting dungeons, but I made it so that you can only reach the connections by using super bombs (which I made scarce until after the 7th dungeon). In some of the connecting rooms I hid heart container pieces. However, I haven't used more than one hidden screen to connect them. It would be cool if you created a connection of 5 or more screens, including a room to find a special item that you need to access a different dungeon.

Edited by Lightwulf, 25 May 2011 - 02:15 PM.

[)-( Marchland Malady )-(]

These ideas are meant to make dungeons more interesting. I have noticed that there seems to be a lack of creativity when it comes to dungeon entrances. As CastChaos showed, even the classic graphics can be used to make a unique and recognizable dungeon entrance. Below is a picture of one I made.

Does this fill you with a desire to see what lies inside? Do you know what it is? It is the entrance to a giant yellow-jacket nest made out of cement. The bottom cell that the path in the cacti goes to is the entrance. See if you can make some interesting entrances of your own.

In some of the Might and Magic games, the player was given a description of the dungeon about to be entered and a more detailed image of the dungeon entrance before going inside. It is not impossible to do this in Zelda Classic quests and it should make dungeons more fascinating. It it worth noting that in Might and Magic VII some dungeons connected to others.

[Moosh]

I can't say it would draw me in exactly...more like the very bland field of cacti would repel me inside...

But yeah, I get your point. I feel that your screen just looks a bit too...liningthingsuppy? Checkerboardy? I can't explain it.

[TheLegend_njf]

That's why I incorporated "Trapped in" dungeons in my game. The first three levels trap you in. So you are still forced to beat them even if you get the dungeon item. Than the fourth level is required get into the second world. So getting the first Triforce piece is a journey in itself. The idea was risky, but it worked well!

[)-( Marchland Malady )-(]

Trap dungeons are good for storytelling and having the main character tossed into jail but should not be overused. Did you read the ideas about connecting dungeons, having more than one dungeon per level, and having different parts of dungeons be part of different levels? There are some good ideas in there.

Triforce pieces don't have to be in dungeons. You could have the player go through one to get to a part of the overworld where a piece is or hide the object required to get it in one of them.