377 replies to this topic

[Eddy]

Been playing more MM1 today and I just beat all the robot masters and I'm ready to tackle the Wily stages. My thoughts on Bombman, Elecman and Fireman are as follows:

 

Bombman: His stage wasn't too bad, though it was kinda annoying through the upward corridor part where you got bombs flying at you when trying to climb a ladder. Bombman himself was a bit of a pain, especially since I can't dodge his bombs sometimes (though I'm generally shit at dodging in platformers anyway lol).

 

Fireman: Easily my favourite and easiest robot master stage. I liked this stage a lot mostly because of the fire, and the fact that there wasn't anything crazy and absurd and I could actually beat it without dying... until I got to Fireman. I have absolutely no idea how you're supposed to avoid his fire attacks, but with the ice attacks, I cleared him pretty quickly.

 

Elecman: The only main issue with this stage is the beginning where you have those speedy floor things, I found that really annoying but the rest of the level was fine, though I do hate having to wait for the electricity to go away when climbing the ladders. Elecman himself is just a joke. I mean come on, I expected something a bit tougher than that. 3-4 hits with the cut attack and that's it, done, not difficult at all.

 

So yeah, I have a feeling the Wily stages are gonna suck but I'll see I guess.

[Aevin]

I always found ElecMan to be murderously hard, even with the right weapon. I'm glad you had an easy time with him.

[Eddy]

I always found ElecMan to be murderously hard, even with the right weapon. I'm glad you had an easy time with him.

I guess that's the power of spamming weapons? XD

[Aevin]

So ... one of the major ideas of Mega Man X is that there's this awesome new type of robot with the ability to "think, feel and make their own decisions". But ... couldn't the original Mega Man do all, or at least almost all, of that already? Thinking is a no brainer. He has to be able to think in order to act. Feeling ... I'm pretty sure there have been several times in the series when they've shown emotion from Mega Man, (say nothing of unofficial sources). Finally, in Mega Man 7's ending, Mega Man even seems able to disobey the laws of robotics. He's bent on killing Wily once and for all, and when Wily points out robots aren't supposed to harm humans, he replies, "I am more than a robot! Die, Wily!"  The only thing that stops him is the sudden collapse of the lab.

 

Seems to me like Mega Man already had all of the supposedly innovative traits that X possesses.

[Orithan]

Eddy, did you get the Magnet Beam from ElecMan's stage? If not, you have to go collect it to advance through Wily Stage 1.

[kurt91]

Finally, in Mega Man 7's ending, Mega Man even seems able to disobey the laws of robotics. He's bent on killing Wily once and for all, and when Wily points out robots aren't supposed to harm humans, he replies, "I am more than a robot! Die, Wily!"

 

Just so you're aware, that line wasn't in the original Japanese version and was added to the American version to try and make Mega Man look more badass. The original version of that cutscene was that Mega actually wasn't able to bring himself to harm Wily personally, meaning he really is 3-Laws Compliant. (As long as you ignore the argument that killing Wily would be better for humanity as a whole, making murder in this case 3-Laws Compliant.)

 

I believe that MM9's plot was meant to imply the point where Light was starting to realize that for as close as Mega was to having full free will and everything that makes X special, he was still a subserviant robot at his core. (I've never played the game myself, I'm going off what I've heard of that game's plot.) Mega went through the whole game not fully understanding why the Robot Masters were so against being shut down and dismantled once their expiration date came up. That revealed to Light that as close as Mega Man was to being like X, he still had minor issues in his programming regarding the values of artificial life compared to human life.

 

I think that MM9 was the point where Light decided to start planning out X's design, and the Roboenza outbreak in 10 was the beginning of Wily's work on the Zero Virus, thus making the two games the link between the Classic and X series. If that's right, then I have a question myself. I've heard that games 1, 2, and 3 go together as a sort of sub-series or something (I don't know the exact term. Like how Battle Network 2 & 3 go the closest together, and 4 & 5 go closest together in that series), and this plot connection ties 9 and 10 together. What sets are put together out of 4 through 8?

[Aevin]

Just so you're aware, that line wasn't in the original Japanese version and was added to the American version to try and make Mega Man look more badass. The original version of that cutscene was that Mega actually wasn't able to bring himself to harm Wily personally, meaning he really is 3-Laws Compliant. (As long as you ignore the argument that killing Wily would be better for humanity as a whole, making murder in this case 3-Laws Compliant.)

Well, I took a look myself, and you're right that the US version took some major liberties there.　Here's my personal translation, if anyone's interested:

Wily: I won't struggle, so please forgive me!

Rock: You can't trick me, Wily! *charges buster*

Wily: Are you going to shoot? Are you really going to shoot me?! You, a robot, would shoot me, a human?!

Rock: .......

*the lab begins to collapse, interrupting them*

To me, it seems to leave it ambiguous, but also less directly references the law of robotics. Wily doesn't so much say "Robots are forbidden to harm humans," as he seems shocked and terrified at the idea. As for the change ... ugh. I've always thought that seemed out of character. I hate it when they change stuff like that.

[Eddy]

Eddy, did you get the Magnet Beam from ElecMan's stage? If not, you have to go collect it to advance through Wily Stage 1.

Waaaay ahead of ya. Got it already.

[Russ]

So Moosh, Dan, and I all played Megaman 4 last night. And the verdict... I can't say I'm a huge fan of it. The stages had cool gimmicks, but also had their fair share of questionable enemy placements and the like. The robot masters were nothing special, and one of them had outright mandatory damage unless you only hit him with charge shots, which is pretty terrible. By the time I got to Cossack stage 1, I'd had enough. It reminded me of MM2's Wily Stage 1... not in a good way though, mind you. The ice floors and enemies they were combined with were annoying, the ascension at the end was also annoying, and it does the MM2 thing where if you lose to the boss, you get to do it all over again. The final boss also pulls a MM2; if you don't have that one weapon that you probably used all up during the boss rematches, you're just out of luck. All in all, it may not be as bad as MM2, and it shows some legitimately cool ideas, but it's certainly below 1 and 3.

[The Satellite]

The final boss also pulls a MM2; if you don't have that one weapon that you probably used all up during the boss rematches, you're just out of luck.

Wrong. You can still damage him. It's just kinda difficult. Whereas in 2, you really are out of luck. Not that it's a hard boss there...

[Air Luigi]

So Moosh, Dan, and I all played Megaman 4 last night. And the verdict... I can't say I'm a huge fan of it. The stages had cool gimmicks, but also had their fair share of questionable enemy placements and the like. The robot masters were nothing special, and one of them had outright mandatory damage unless you only hit him with charge shots, which is pretty terrible. By the time I got to Cossack stage 1, I'd had enough. It reminded me of MM2's Wily Stage 1... not in a good way though, mind you. The ice floors and enemies they were combined with were annoying, the ascension at the end was also annoying, and it does the MM2 thing where if you lose to the boss, you get to do it all over again. The final boss also pulls a MM2; if you don't have that one weapon that you probably used all up during the boss rematches, you're just out of luck. All in all, it may not be as bad as MM2, and it shows some legitimately cool ideas, but it's certainly below 1 and 3.

 

 

You should play the first Ninja Gaiden to see what is "questionable enemy placements" X) Remember that you have more weapons than the megabuster.

 

Robot Masters are that way since MM4, they only get worse and worse in the series.

[Maleboocado]

MM9 is the best classic Mega Man game for me. Good weapon balance for the most part (you still have overpowered weapons that can be used too many times, like Galaxy Man's black hole, though), a lot less focus on pure memorization and bullshit sudden traps, great diversity, fair difficulty (for a MM game), highly replayable, the best OST in the series, good bosses...

Too bad there's the small details that makes me aware this is a 2008 game, like the smooth fade in/out transitions and the main menu. I think MM9 is what Mega Man shouls have been in the first place, but the series started to degenerate with MM3...

[Nicholas Steel]

I prefer Megaman 10's music than Megaman 9's. It has a lot more good songs overall.

[Maleboocado]

I have heard some tracks a few years ago (haven't played MM10, I watched some levels on Youtube and I wasn't interested, maybe it's a well made game...). There are good tracks, but I don't find them as charismatic or catchy as 9's overall.

But at least there are nowhere as forgetable for me as MM3's tracks, lol (I cannot even remember an entire song and I have played the game several times). But then again I struggle trying to remember the bosses or the stages themselves or the weapons. I still don't know why.

Edited by Maleboocado, 29 September 2014 - 11:25 AM.

[Nicholas Steel]

For Megaman 9 and 10 I listen to the NSF renditions that Mathew Valente created, not the original copies used in the games (Because the original copies are mono for some stupid reason [The NES is mono!]). The original copies of the songs included in the game also sound muffled and low quality.

Edited by franpa, 29 September 2014 - 11:45 AM.