Jump to content

Photo

Osama Bin Laden dead!


  • Please log in to reply
137 replies to this topic

#91 Schwa

Schwa

    Enjoy the Moment more. This strengthens Imagination.

  • Members
  • Real Name:Hunter S.
  • Location:Redmond Subspace (I had a Potion)

Posted 03 May 2011 - 01:45 AM

Last night I saw all the people rallied around and chanting "USA! USA!" on Da Newz in celebration of Osama's death. It made me sick. icon_confused.gif

You can say anything you want, but Osama WON. He might be dead, but he won. He did what he was out to do and we eagerly helped him.

What do I mean by this? Well, will airport security stop being so tight now that he's gone? Will the unnecessarily high budget for national secuity ease up even a little? Will people stop being so paranoid in general? No, not at all. The damage has been done ages ago (Why are they called "terrorists", anyway? Think about it), and it won't let up any time soon because panic feeds off each-other and a society like ours is too massive for any healing to be done; the bigger the society, the larger the wound, and the larger the wound, the less and less chance it has to mend itself.

Whether Osama's dead or not, my belief is the same; the News are the real terrorists, and basically always have been. Now that Osama's dead, all the News has to do is change their tactics a little and they won't lose any of their power and grip over our minds and hearts. So what if one excuse for a crisis doesn't exist anymore? It's easy to make up yet another.

Edited by Schwa, 03 May 2011 - 01:46 AM.


#92 Taco Chopper

Taco Chopper

    green and retired

  • Members
  • Pronouns:He / Him
  • Location:South Australia

Posted 03 May 2011 - 03:17 AM

Sorry to throw the topic back on a negative path, but...

QUOTE(Ornlu @ May 3 2011, 01:39 AM) View Post

Remind me how 3,000 is comparable to between 11 and 17 million.

I didn't actually know he killed about 3000 people, but that's because I'm ignorant about statistics sometimes. icon_frown.gif My bad, but point taken. And a very good point at that.

QUOTE(Ornlu @ May 3 2011, 01:39 AM) View Post

The US itself killed over 100 thousand people with one bomb, almost all of them regular citizens.

With that, is it reasonable to say that the US itself may be as big a monster as the ones the media depicts Al-Qaeda and other terrorist organisations to be? Or is that different because we're "fighting for freedom"?

QUOTE(William @ May 3 2011, 04:55 AM) View Post

Out of the frying pan, into the fire. I'm sure that now that this problem with Bin Laden is over, we'll have a new one. As it is, people who like killing and have a lot of guns aren't that hard to come by these days. I'm sure Al Queda will find someone new; this doesn't end the war on terrorism.

There's already talk that they're already considering a replacement for him. But again, as I stated in my first post, I still doubt Al-Qaeda will be as strong as they used to be.

#93 NoeL

NoeL

    Legend

  • Members
  • Real Name:Jerram

Posted 03 May 2011 - 03:21 AM

I haven't read all six pages, but from what I saw I'm glad so many of you share my distaste for "justice". Makes me feel better after seeing the aforementioned "USA! USA!" chants.

Not sure if it's been posted already, but if it hasn't, this Freudian slip made me lol:
IPB Image

Good ol' Faux Noise. Always good for a laugh.

#94 Lemon

Lemon

    Legend

  • Members

Posted 03 May 2011 - 06:43 AM

^Fox also had the [i] fantastic "BREAKING NEWS" line on their site that declared Usama Bin Landen: confrimed dead. Usama is fine, that's an acceptable way to spell it (and a great way to avoid Osama/Obama confusion, but there's two other errors there that any good news outlet shouldn't make. It was up for about thirty minutes that night. I work at a newspaper, so I can make fun of Fox for this sort of stuff icon_biggrin.gif.


I think it's interesting how people've reacted to this. Not good, not bad, but curious. It's fun to watch half the people treat this like a football game, and another half pretentiously judge the state of the nation based on it. Others calling for a body, while more complain that we gave him a burial at sea. A few are demanding trial, and others are using this as a moment to express their cynicism and general complaints about humanity as a whole.

We're incredibly opinionated creatures.

Edited by Timothy McCorgi, 03 May 2011 - 06:44 AM.


#95 Moosh

Moosh

    The Mush

  • Moderators

Posted 03 May 2011 - 02:42 PM

So I've just heard that apparently, Osama may have been Al Qaeda's one voice of semi-reason...vid related:

Edited by Pokemonmaster64, 03 May 2011 - 02:44 PM.


#96 Mitchfork

Mitchfork

    no fun. not ever.

  • Members
  • Real Name:Mitch
  • Location:Alabama

Posted 03 May 2011 - 03:11 PM

QUOTE(Pokemonmaster64 @ May 3 2011, 02:42 PM) View Post

So I've just heard that apparently, Osama may have been Al Qaeda's one voice of semi-reason...vid related:

"So I've just heard that apparently" is not a valid source. icon_unsettled.gif Before you make speculation, please provide some evidence.

I mean, without linking to a news source or opinion column or something we have no idea what you're really talking about.

#97 Sheik

Sheik

    Deified

  • Members

Posted 03 May 2011 - 03:19 PM

First of, I do notice the posts of those that share similar opinions as I do. I just don't comment on them, though, because I devote my posts to those, that are standing in for other views. I also respect these other perspectives, but I don't share them. All I do is trying to spark a little empathy in at least someone. I do not intend to insult anyone.

What many of you guys seem to oversee is this: Osama Bin Laden did not personally kill anyone of the victims of 9/11. He wasn't carrying out the actions that led to the death of thousands of people. It is very likely that he was resposbile that these actions took place, but I highly doubt it was him alone who was resposible. Osama Bin Laden did most certainly not rule AQ like a monarch or anything. I strongly believe that there's a sort of "government" (if you could call it like that) in AQ that decides what actions are to be carried out and what not. Osama Bin Laden was most likely just a (or rather the) respresentive of AQ. So it is in fact wrong to say that he killed thousands of people. Because he did not. He was the respresantive of an (politcal !) organisation that is resonsible for actions that led to the death of thousands of people. There is a differece here.
Also, Osama Bin Laden was no "monster" or "super villain". He was a human. And humans are not black and white. Just think about yourselves. You are not only workers or only students or only Americans or whatever. You are so much more. You are friends, you are lovers, you are partens, you are children, you are members of PZC, you are.... . You take many, many different roles in live. Every human does, because that is how society (and in great parts the human brain) works. Osama Bin Laden was not only the respresentive of AQ, he was not only some (islamist ?) fundamentalist/extremist. He was, for example, also a father. And he could not have been the worst at that, to say the least, given he accepted that his son did not want to be part of AQ/terrorism anymore. There's not many parents that allow and support that their children live different (moral) concepts than they do. Not many in fact.

So does this make things any different? Osama Bin Laden was at least partly responsible for the death of thousands of people. For that, he had to be brought to justice. But this justice should not have been murder. It should not have been torture either. No human has the right, and no human can justify, to do harm to another human. Not even if that other human was a murderer (or resposible for murder). Try to apply the easiest ethic rules you know. Just take the golden rule, for example. Would you want yourself to be sentenced to death? No, rather not. How are you justified in putting death penalty on someone else? Do you feel justfied in killing because someone else killed? How? It has already been quoted earlier in some post, but Gandhi got it right: An eye for an eye leaves the whole world blind.
You can not justfiy these actions. Not out of an urge or revenge either. Try to look at the big picture. What kind of society do you want to be part of?

Ideed, nothing brings so much hatred cruelty and murder to this world like the "good cause". And you'd think that the "good" would want to get rid of harted, cruelty and murder. Do you consider cruelty, hatred and murder good? Than why do you support it? Because others (on your and the other side) do so, too? How does that justify anything?

One last thing: I also have empathy for those, that are cheery about Osama Bin Laden's death. I can feel where you are coming from. But empathy is something that has to be applied to everyone. If it isn't, it's hypocracy. Thus this, which could be misread for "sympathy" for Bin Laden - I certainly don't have that - is rather empathy. And empathy I can find within me for anyone (at least that's an ideal I want to live).
Really, why are so many people so blind with harted? What in the world did they do to you, to make such haters out of you?

Edited by Sheik91, 03 May 2011 - 03:24 PM.


#98 Arthas

Arthas

    Adept

  • Members

Posted 03 May 2011 - 09:25 PM

This will have absolutely no effect on the wars in the middle east and worldwide terrorism. Osama and al qaeda have been irrelevant for years now.

It will however assure Obama's re-election. Republican candidates stand no chance.

Edited by Arthas, 03 May 2011 - 09:26 PM.


#99 NoeL

NoeL

    Legend

  • Members
  • Real Name:Jerram

Posted 03 May 2011 - 09:29 PM

QUOTE(Arthas @ May 3 2011, 08:25 PM) View Post
This will have absolutely no effect on the wars in the middle east and worldwide terrorism. Osama and al qaeda have been irrelevant for years now.

It will however assure Obama's re-election. Republican candidates stand no chance.
QFT.

Also, what are you doing back here?


#100 Ben

Ben

    a very grumpy

  • Members

Posted 03 May 2011 - 11:07 PM

I doubt that this will have much effect on Obama's re-election chances (it will have some, but not much.) Eventually people will realize that gas prices are still high and that the economy is in the tank, among other things. A military operation to kill one man, no matter how significant he was, is not going to be the redeeming factor -- Bin Laden's death didn't suddenly make everyone's lives full of happiness, prosperity, and rainbows. Also consider the fact that the left side seems to be stuck wearing huge smug grins while the right wasted no time leveraging the situation and getting to work against them.

Edited by Bagel, 03 May 2011 - 11:08 PM.


#101 Radien

Radien

    Courage

  • Members
  • Real Name:Steve
  • Location:Oregon

Posted 04 May 2011 - 01:55 AM

QUOTE(Bagel @ May 3 2011, 09:07 PM) View Post
I doubt that this will have much effect on Obama's re-election chances (it will have some, but not much.) Eventually people will realize that gas prices are still high and that the economy is in the tank, among other things. A military operation to kill one man, no matter how significant he was, is not going to be the redeeming factor -- Bin Laden's death didn't suddenly make everyone's lives full of happiness, prosperity, and rainbows. Also consider the fact that the left side seems to be stuck wearing huge smug grins while the right wasted no time leveraging the situation and getting to work against them.

Historically, perceived military leadership counts for a lot in garnering votes. Look at George W. Bush. He did an absolutely horrible job, and in retrospect almost everybody is able to agree on that... but he somehow managed to get reelected by convincing voters that he had stronger military leadership, even though the only reason such leadership would be needed at all was a war he started.

I'm not saying that bin Laden's dispatch *should* ensure Obama's reelection, at least not on its own...but to be realistic, I think that it will inevitably become a major factor. It looks really good on a resume`, so to speak. icon_razz.gif

#102 Sheik

Sheik

    Deified

  • Members

Posted 04 May 2011 - 03:19 AM

Actually, not Obama managed to kill Bin Laden but the government under his leadership (and he's no monarch either - rather a representive) was resposible for the military actions that took place that led to Bin Laden's death. Just like Bush didn't start a war but rather the government under his leadership was responsible for military actions that took place that started a war. Not single people rule your countries but rather goverments, parties (republicans or democrats that is in America, right?). Why do you refuse to make that difference? Because it's easier to blame it on single indiiduals?
On a more acstract level, they've carried out the will of the people, actually (though I doubt that in our post-democratic times/societies). To take this some further, it was actually you (your will, the will of the majority) that killed Bin Laden or started a war (which is of course mostly not true, but that's like democracies work, should actually make one wonder...).

#103 NoeL

NoeL

    Legend

  • Members
  • Real Name:Jerram

Posted 04 May 2011 - 03:36 AM

QUOTE(Sheik91 @ May 4 2011, 02:19 AM) View Post
Actually, not Obama managed to kill Bin Laden but the government under his leadership (and he's no monarch either - rather a representive) was resposible for the military actions that took place that led to Bin Laden's death.
Allegedly the military had planned to just bomb the mansion but Obama wanted to send in seals instead, which turned out to be the right move.

#104 Arthas

Arthas

    Adept

  • Members

Posted 04 May 2011 - 07:08 PM

QUOTE(Arthas @ May 3 2011, 08:25 PM) View Post

This will have absolutely no effect on the wars in the middle east and worldwide terrorism. Osama and al qaeda have been irrelevant for years now.

It will however assure Obama's re-election. Republican candidates stand no chance.


Meh I lurk here from time to time.

#105 Adem

Adem

    -

  • Members
  • Real Name:Anything except rap and country.
  • Location:New England

Posted 04 May 2011 - 07:45 PM

Saw this quote, earlier...Thought I would share.

"I mourn the loss of thousands of precious lives, but I will not rejoice in the death of one, not even an enemy. Returning hate for hate multiplies hate, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness: only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate: only love can do that" --Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr

Edited by Rem, 04 May 2011 - 07:46 PM.



1 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 1 guests, 0 anonymous users