429 replies to this topic

[Snarwin]

So, let me get this straight. They've taken the explorable overworld, one of the hallmarks of the series, and literally put it on rails.

[Fabbrizio]

So, why not reuse Twilight Princess's game engine? Well, there are two reasons I can think of:

1.) Twilight Princess actually reuses Wind Waker's engine. I know, it's really hard to tell due to the total graphical style change and other tweaks. But the basic Wind Waker engine is still present under all of those stark differences.

2.) Twilight Princess was actually designed for Gamecube hardware. Reusing its engine would probably ensure that the next Wii Zelda is less impressive than it could be. I bet they'll want to build the engine from scratch, in order to take advantage of the remote/nunchuk combo. (Still not sure whether I should be worried about this...)

But if they used the wind waker engine itself, and modified it, Spirit Tracks would easily be much more enjoyable. Wind Waker had quality graphics, while Phantom Hourglass was kind of square; Wind Waker used the Gamecube to it's full capacity in it's massive overworlds and (much to one's surprise) even larger dungeons; the completely realistic sea could have fooled anyone, and bear in mind this is a game system which is quite noisy and low tech by today's standards.

[Snarwin]

But if they used the wind waker engine itself, and modified it, Spirit Tracks would easily be much more enjoyable.

The Wind Waker engine was written for Gamecube hardware. Spirit Tracks is a DS game.

I'm sure you can see where I'm going with this.

[Fabbrizio]

The Wind Waker engine was written for Gamecube hardware. Spirit Tracks is a DS game.

I'm sure you can see where I'm going with this.

But it all leads back to the fact that it shout be on Wii. It's been said by at least five different people in this thread.

[Mitchfork]

And as Radien pointed out, using the Wind Waker engine on the Wii would lead to a product that doesn't take advantage of the Wii features. They're going for the DS because it is probably much less expensive and time-consuming to modify the PH engine slightly, change a few graphics, and build new maps than to create a new engine and game from scratch. Honestly, I'm happy it's on the DS so I can at least have faith in the console games.

[SpacemanDan]

Honestly, I'm just going to leave judgement until I actually get to play it. I does seem a little odd, but honestly, I think it's got some potential, personally. At least it won't be a lot of friggen water like before. I got so tired of sailing after WW and PH. (PH wasn't as bad, for sailing, IMO, tough.) I'm interested in seeing where this goes.

[Linkus]

I do not have anything against the game being on the DS. Besides, why are people even complaining anyway on the length of time between the games? Look at the time difference between LA and OOT - 5 years - and now you feel like it's been forever.

In other words, you(as a whole) just want something memorable for the right reasons, and not from all the problems that you find with the recent addition to the series. Something that keeps you happy until the next game - whether it be the battle, story (Face it, more story elements are becoming essential parts of a game, of so get used to it), logic, or just overall fun.

Another thing to keep in mind is that the series evolved. It's not going to be all about big battles and confusing labyrinths anymore, but instead something that makes a little more sense - Hence the story elements that just became darker and darker as the next game came to be.

Basically, we want Hyrule to be completely and utterly destroyed (and look like it actually happened - dead trees and brown grass included). And then bring it back with the very courage you hold in you hand. Yes, we want a darker story. Yes, we want Link to show that he has a dark side, that he's not always an overall good guy, and will cross the line when it comes to saving Hyrule. We just want a realistic situation.

However, the problem I see is the entirety of players involved with the series and those who make the games - Be it Nintendo or Capcom for the time. Nobody has the patience to see a notable game be made, nor have a general, agreed-upon opinion on what the next game in the series needs.

But, one thing I think many can agree upon, is that the series does not need a gimmick. No, things like the Ocarina of Time and the Wind Waker aren't gimmicks, since they play a very crucial part in their respective games, and have a very wide use. But, a train? Not very versatile - It would just be better off giving Link a car or a bike for that matter. Course, the problem with this is that the car nor the bike doesn't fit very well. As for the train? Well, the same can be said here. I just can't see how a train would be so useful or versatile - It's a very sore thumb in the series that just needs to be explained.

Overall, I do believe the goal is to get more young people interested in the Zelda series. But I don't think Nintendo needs to bow down so low to attract a younger generation. Personally, attracting 3-year-olds is just too young - Something a little more feasible, and way more powerful(and portable too) that looks much more mature should be used, but isn't too menacing.

Maybe it's time to reach out and have a creative concept contest for the next Zelda - An outreach to the fans and creative minds, along with understanding the true situation the series lies at.

Edited by Linkus, 28 March 2009 - 03:17 PM.

[Moonbread]

Look at the time difference between LA and OOT - 5 years - and now you feel like it's been forever.

Yeah, but you gotta remember that a lot of people here are fairly young... >.> So they don't really remember that.

[Fabbrizio]

O

M

GAWD!!!!!!


I just figured it out! It totally proves my timeline theory!
The trailers show a new incarnation of Hyrule Castle, right? Well, then that means that Hyrule is rebuilt atop the great sea during the time of WW link! Unless Spirit Tracks is not truly a sequel to Wind Waker, in which case everything falls apart dammit.

[Radien]

But it all leads back to the fact that it shout be on Wii. It's been said by at least five different people in this thread.

Nintendo's handhelds are much more popular in Japan. In the West we tend to buy more of their home consoles (and there are more of us, so that probably makes the two demographics pretty comparable).

Japanese gamers prefer cute stuff. Western gamers lean somewhat more towards cinematic and realistic. I would also venture to guess that most Western handheld owners are kids. Thus it makes sense for Nintendo's cute stuff to be on handhelds while the more realistic stuff is slated for home consoles.

Business-wise, the idea of Toon Link being on handhelds and Adult Link appearing on home consoles is very sound, since they'd reach their target audiences in bigger numbers. If you look at it that way, Wind Waker was just a way to introduce the cartoon Zelda style and test it out on Eastern and Western audiences. The home consoles almost always have better hardware, yes, but audience is more important than hardware. Besides, it's always been the case that it's easier to render "cute and simple" than "detailed and realistic."

Honestly, I'm happy it's on the DS so I can at least have faith in the console games.

I definitely agree, for the reasons I stated above. If we're going to have both cute and realistic, keep the cute stuff on the handhelds and the realistic stuff on the home consoles.

However, I do think Toon Link should have remained 2-dimensional on the DS. Minish Cap was more visually appealing than Phantom Hourglass, IMO, even though PH was on a more advanced platform.

Another thing to keep in mind is that the series evolved. It's not going to be all about big battles and confusing labyrinths anymore, but instead something that makes a little more sense - Hence the story elements that just became darker and darker as the next game came to be.

Basically, we want Hyrule to be completely and utterly destroyed (and look like it actually happened - dead trees and brown grass included). And then bring it back with the very courage you hold in you hand. Yes, we want a darker story. Yes, we want Link to show that he has a dark side, that he's not always an overall good guy, and will cross the line when it comes to saving Hyrule. We just want a realistic situation.

Uhh...

Personally, I don't really want any of the things you stated above.

The trailers show a new incarnation of Hyrule Castle, right? Well, then that means that Hyrule is rebuilt atop the great sea during the time of WW link! Unless Spirit Tracks is not truly a sequel to Wind Waker, in which case everything falls apart dammit.

It's been 7 years since Wind Waker was released in Japan, and there have been two other major Toon-style Zelda games since it came out (more if you count the minor ones). Nintendo's pretty lazy about wrapping up loose ends. It's possible they will eventually, but I wouldn't get excited about the prospect this early.

Also, how can you rebuild land? Continents floating on top of the water? That's kinda weird even for Zelda.

[Aslion]

Was the only funny thing you did call the video 'Zelda is Dead' and write in the caption how you don't like it?

I was hoping there'd be some annotations about how bad it looks or something =(

I might try that, good idea actually.

[Mitchfork]

O

M

GAWD!!!!!!
I just figured it out! It totally proves my timeline theory!
The trailers show a new incarnation of Hyrule Castle, right? Well, then that means that Hyrule is rebuilt atop the great sea during the time of WW link! Unless Spirit Tracks is not truly a sequel to Wind Waker, in which case everything falls apart dammit.

Plus it totally defeats the point of Wind Waker, was that the old Hyrule was great and all but trying to bring it back is meaningless. Zelda and Link have to find their own destiny. The only way this could be a Wind Waker sequel is if it followed the route of Phantom Hourglass, where Link is just plopped into another compartmentalized world, or if Link finds a new land beyond the Great Sea, which could make sense storyline-wise.

Still, a train.

[Radien]

Plus it totally defeats the point of Wind Waker, was that the old Hyrule was great and all but trying to bring it back is meaningless. Zelda and Link have to find their own destiny.

Ehhh, I always figured that was just the King of Hyrule's opinion. Can't say I ever really agreed with him. I think he was just being a know-it-all father and trying to look out for the kids, rather than thinking in the long-term.

Besides, we all know it was really just an excuse to have another nautical adventure or two before ditching the Great Sea.

The only way this could be a Wind Waker sequel is if it followed the route of Phantom Hourglass, where Link is just plopped into another compartmentalized world, or if Link finds a new land beyond the Great Sea, which could make sense storyline-wise.

Still, a train.

Still... why would Hyrule be flooded, but not the other lands? Considering how high the flood was, that suggests to us that either A.) all neighboring lands sharing the same world suffered the same fate, or B.) Hyrule is a huge trough. Or perhaps C.) All lands bordering Hyrule have magical borders rather than sharing the same world...but this idea bothers me somewhat.

Anyway, ocean or no, Phantom Hourglass kinda circumvented the problem by pulling a "Link's Awakening" on us. It'd be annoying to see Nintendo do that twice in a row, since they use the "was it all a dream?" trope quite often already.

.

[Mitchfork]

Oh, no doubt. I was thinking more of a Holodrum/Labrynna/Termina type world, akin to your point C. I think with the audience in mind, a deep storyline won't really be attempted, so it's a safe bet either that scenario will be used or the laws of biology will be rewritten to accommodate the flood receding and trees springing up in a couple of weeks.

Ehhh, I always figured that was just the King of Hyrule's opinion. Can't say I ever really agreed with him. I think he was just being a know-it-all father and trying to look out for the kids, rather than thinking in the long-term.

I liked it, because it basically threw down the misconceptions of a kingdom being purely physical and let you know that the spirit of Hyrule, what really matters, will live on with the Triforce.

...I'm sorry, I'm in literature mode. I won't try to break down the major themes and motifs, honest.

[Marco]

oh god, I knew one day it would come to this. Nintendo better do a better job than this next Zelda game ( If there will be....this may very well be the end. Ganon wins this time. ) Nintendo sure did loose their originality in PH, and from that game I knew the seris was going to hell.

I will download the rom, when it comes out. But I am not going to waste 30 bucks for a damn choo choo train.