899 replies to this topic

[Ranagus]

The warp into Sagittarius takes you to the wrong place after getting Iron.  I reported this earlier but I saw no mention of it being fixed. 

 

[C-Dawg]

Hah, and JUST as I was preparing an upload, too.  I tried to recreate that on my side and it wasn't working.  Let me try again.

 

Are you encountering this bug before or after you talk to Dr. Mo in Aries?

 

EDIT: N'm, found it and fixed it.

Edited by C-Dawg, 01 August 2015 - 03:51 PM.

[Ranagus]

I'm not sure, maybe after?  The warp I used was in the version of Mo's lab with her and Iron missing. 

 

I went back to the lab just now to try and recreate this (after visiting the Pandora) and got the screen and dialog from earlier in the plot.

[C-Dawg]

That's unusual... tell me, after you reached that screen, were you still able to access the Pandora?

[Ranagus]

Yes.

 

EDIT:

 

To clarify, this happened before I confronted the final boss.  When I tried it on another save with the first fight done, the lab worked as intended.

Edited by Ranagus, 01 August 2015 - 08:09 PM.

[C-Dawg]

I'm perplexed, then. The condition for removing Dr Mo from the lab should be identical to the one for acessing the Pandora. I'll look into it.

[Ranagus]

Actually after more testing, winning the boss fight isn't causing the lab to correct its self.  I have no idea what the difference is between the 2 saves. 

Edited by Ranagus, 01 August 2015 - 08:43 PM.

[C-Dawg]

Doing my own playthrough now... looks like some of the very early bosses missed the memo on relative hit points.  Whoops! 

[C-Dawg]

Finished drawing the sprites for the first boss of the optional material.  As I wrap up Zodiac, I'm branching out to use utilities that I can use when I start working in other programming languages.  I'm learning how to use Aseprite at the moment for drawing art assets, and man, is that a cool thing.  It's like MS Paint, but you can add "frames" so all of your animation is organized in the same file, you can use layers like photoshop, you can zoom in much more deeply, and -- this is the best part -- if you load a .png you exported from Zelda Classic, the program automatically detects the palette used and puts it on the side so you can draw in the same colors.  When you're done, you can export another .png and it will seamlessly load back into ZQuest without recoloring.  Sweet.  

 

One thing I did wrong here; make the transparent color in your palette something OTHER than black or white.  Doing that means I still have to recolor those colors, since ZQuest can't tell what's the transparent color (alpha channel?) when it imports.

 

Also, the wife gave me a WACOM to mess with.  I'll try this out and see if it also takes my spiriting to a new level.

 

Anyway, all of this lets me make larger, better animated, and more complicated bosses.  So expect a few of those along the alternative route through the game, once you get to it.

 

And, our good friend MeleeWizard is starting his Let's Play of the August 1 polished beta.  So, look for that later in the month on his YouTube channel.  That should be some amazing "marketing" material, and I encourage folks to subscribe to his channel as a thank you for his help.

[C-Dawg]

First boss of the alternative route is done, except for some minor tweaking.  I won't spoil it for you, but suffice to say this one manipulates the field of battle in a more serious way than any other boss does.  There's an element of random unfairness at play, but I'm tweaking it try and ensure it's frustrating but not impossible and that your death will still be your own fault.

 

Next steps:

1. Code an item to replace the Wall Cling on the alternate path;

2. Ensure you cannot have Wall Cling if you start on this path;

3. Check carefully on back part of game to make sure this new item gives you an alternate path through the end game stuff, not necessarily the same path as the one used when you have Wall Cling; 

4. Code replacement cut-scenes for new path;

5. Design new secret area for next plot branch (perhaps Snake Zone will live again, albiet in a modified form).

6. Code the secrets to find if you end up on the best possible path;

7. Code the cutscenes at the end game for both the alternate and best possible paths;

8. Design best two endings based on the same.

9. Code a very sneaky absolute-no-kidding-best ending.  I won't tell you how to get it, but if I can do what I think I can do, it should take me very little time at all to code and be almost impossible to beta test.  (Mystery!)

10. Design boss rush mode.   (Pretty much just point-and-click.)

11. Design TGL mode.  (A little bit more complicated)

 

Hopefully, by the time I'm done with that, MeleeWizard's exhaustive playthrough will have identified any remaining gameplay issues I can correct, and we can finally call this project complete.  He's starting his uploads on August 16, so I hear, so mark your calendars.

Edited by C-Dawg, 12 August 2015 - 11:47 AM.

[newstarshipsmell]

M10 S1A (Explosive Missile boss) has Tile Warp A set to "Insta-Warp with Wave Effects" - I assume this should be "Insta-Warp" instead like the rest of the boss room warps?

The Pick-3 rooms still display a piece of energy below the alien (at position 115 I think?) while you are picking up an upgrade. (Less importantly, the platforms still absorb shots above them.)

M4 S63: Sandblocks at Postion 131,132,133,167 all turn from wavy-bottomed sandblocks into solid square sandblocks when secrets revealed (bombable blocks bombed.)
3x1 combo block at position 47-63-79 does not align with adjacent 2x1 combo in S64.
1x4 combo block at position 172-175 does not align with adjacent 2x3 combo block in S73.

M10 S3C: Looks like it uses the same screen for an overhead layer as M1 S54, so the combos at position 148+149 end up darker/underwater compared to the others on that row. Suggest using a different screen without those two positions filled with water? Or just cover the entire row with water instead?

The pyramids in the corridors that shoot the homing shots are drawn above your shots, which looks strange when they pass underneath something that's visually below you.
I think they have a similar enemy with same behavior/different artwork in later corridors that do the same.

F6 during the Entrance/Exit warp back into labyrinths from cave rooms still resets the continue point to the labyrinth entrance, rather than the door just exited; this does not happen when warping into cave rooms. Guessing this is probably a ZC issue and beyond your control.

Not a bug or a complaint - heh, be careful what you wish for! The new Pulse Hammer does indeed look much better now, but due to the changed mechanic, it is no longer effective against invisible/vanished wizzrobes prior to reappearing, and it is much harder to strike them from the side while they fall past you... makes for some rather trickier gameplay in several spots in Aries.

M4 S51: Still has indestructible sandblocks due to switch.

Recharge rooms are more satisfying now - but they only generate the sound effect for your health, not energy or missiles.

It looks a little odd how your ship remains tilted to one side after releasing the d-pad in the corridor. Can you script it to change your direction faced to up, 0.25-0.5 seconds after releasing left/right? Or change the sprite displayed to the up-facing one without affecting actual orientation, if that matters for aiming other weapons (missiles and whatnot) to the side, and receiving knockback to the opposite direction?

So yeah... really scraping the bottom of the barrell at this point. Gameplay is bugfree for the most part, as far as I can tell. Probably find another dozen things that don't really matter on my playthrough of the current beta.

Edited by newstarshipsmell, 12 August 2015 - 08:09 PM.

[C-Dawg]

Cool, more bugs!  Will get on those.

 

I've completed the final item: the Magnet Grabber.  There are some blocks (grey metal things with four rivets) that this item allows the Guardian to pick up and throw.  They deal damage, but they also stick to solid combos where you throw them, so it can be used as a way to both clear barriers and to create new platforms.  Working on allowing the player to access Libra with this item, and then tweaking the design of various areas to allow a combination of Libra's charge and the Grabber to allow you to proceed (WITHOUT the Wall-Cling.)

 

EDIT: Linked up the boss and Magnet Grabber to the game, and redesigned some rooms.  You can now sneak in there and start the alternate plot path, abandoning Wall Cling in the process. I THINK it's now possible to basically play the whole game with the Grabber instead of the Wall Cling after that.  Grabber makes some rooms that were formerly twitchy platformers into more like puzzles, so thats cool. Leo, Virgo, Capricorn, Sagittarius, and Libra got some overhauls to account for the possible different item makeup.  Once you get the Libra charged shot, Anti-Gravity Device, and Leo Charged shot, you should be able to make up for the lack of mobility.  This stuff probably needs testing, but we'll get there.  Virgo also becomes inaccessible till you get the AGD, which means you go into Capricorn less powered.  Nice.

 

Left to do:

 

4. Code replacement cut-scenes for new path;

5. Design new secret area for next plot branch (perhaps Snake Zone will live again, albiet in a modified form).

6. Code the secrets to find if you end up on the best possible path;

7. Code the cutscenes at the end game for both the alternate and best possible paths;

8. Design best two endings based on the same.

9. Code a very sneaky absolute-no-kidding-best ending.  I won't tell you how to get it, but if I can do what I think I can do, it should take me very little time at all to code and be almost impossible to beta test.  (Mystery!)

10. Design boss rush mode.   (Pretty much just point-and-click.)

11. Design TGL mode.  (A little bit more complicated)

 

EDIT2: Oh, also, I think there's a bug where if you save and quit after facing the wall 'o flesh but before actually finishing the corridor afterwards, you get stuck because you can't get back there to retrieve the Super Missiles.  Will fix!

 

EDIT3: Made the Wall Cling / Magnet Grab choice actually mutually exclusive.  I had initially forgotten to disable the Grabber if you got the Cling first.  Fixed!

Edited by C-Dawg, 15 August 2015 - 10:52 PM.

[newstarshipsmell]

Oh, and D31 S6C still has an F6 trap in that if you have Dash Jets 2 and release R/run out of Energy at position 117, you'll fall out into position 133 below and become stuck. Suggest removing combo at 135 or make 149 bombable.

Edited by newstarshipsmell, 16 August 2015 - 01:47 PM.

[C-Dawg]

Got it.  

 

Also, MeleeWizard's LP is up now.  Hooray!

https://www.youtube....h?v=V-R12t5BTYk

 

Its really interesting to watch someone thinking out loud as they play, learning the mechanics in real time.  I've already decided you were right about the message terminals , for example -- there should be more indication that there is more to listen to after an over-ride.

[newstarshipsmell]

I am currently going through all the DMaps using X,S W and F10 checking for bugs and whatnot. Got a bunch of stuff to post in a few, half or more of which you've probably already fixed in your current version...

I was wrong about the Explosive Missile boss warp being "unlike the others." It looks like you inconsistently used Insta-Warp with Wave Effects for most but not all of the boss fight conclusions (the rest use plain Insta-Warps), so I'm making a list of which are which and where, so you can quickly go through and make them all uniform if you wish.

ETA: Well, these are all mostly cosmetic bugs... and you've probably already fixed a number of them in the current (unreleased) version. I caught these all in ZQ, so some of them may actually be fine (i.e. I just don't know how to look at ZQ properly.) Dunno if the warp types matter / impact gameplay at all.

Entrance/Exit Cave Doors
These rooms have Tile Warp A's Type set to "Entrance/Exit" (which I believe should be "Insta-Warp with Opening Wipe" instead):
M1 S26
M17 S06
M31 S02
M31 S6A
M33 S34
M33 S52
M33 S62
M33 S78
M35 S0D

Insta-Warp with Blackout Cave Doors
These rooms have Tile Warp A's Type set to "Insta-Warp with Blackout" (which I believe should be "Insta-Warp with Opening Wipe" instead):
M13 S0D
M17 S02
M19 S5F
M27 S2A

Warp Zone warps
These Warp Zone rooms have Tile Warp A's Type set to "Insta-Warp with Opening Wipe" (which I believe should be "Insta-Warp with Zap Effects" instead):
M23 S6D
M40 S28

Pick-3 Rooms
These Pick-3 rooms do not have new platforms like the other Pick-3 rooms do:
M51 S01
M51 S0E
M51 S12

Cave Shops
These shops appear to have item boxes that vanish instead of breaking open (presumably they still drop the items properly):
M10 S7C
M25 S3B
M25 S3C
M37 S0F
M40 S45
M51 S14

Recharge Stations
These recharge stations appear to lack energy fields upon purchasing (presumably they still recharge you properly):
M37 S47
M37 S48
M39 S34
M40 S31
M40 S04

Explosives combos
These Explosive combos appear to vanish instead of exploding when destroyed:
M1 S3F pos. 126, 142
M17 S6E pos. 43
M23 S7F pos. 72
M27 S78 pos. 51, 67
M31 S74 pos. 61, 121
M33 S65 pos. 28-29
M40 S0A pos. 40, 85, 136

Supermissile combos
These Supermissile combos appear to vanish instead of exploding when destroyed:
M17 S02 pos. 30, 46, 60
M19 S2B pos. 55-57, 71, 73, 89
M23 S61 pos. 34, 50
M23 S71 pos. 97
M23 S78 pos. 66
M23 S7E pos. 55
M23 S7F pos. 38
M29 S1B pos. 86
M29 S39 pos. 98-99, 114-115
M33 S32 pos. 81-82, 97-98
M33 S59 pos. 26

Old sliding combos
These rooms contain the old slippery/sliding combos (that disappear with secrets triggered):
M29 S23 pos. 162-166
M29 S5D pos. 143, 175
M29 S6A pos. 160-161, 163, 165-169
M37 S09 pos. 144-155
M37 S0A pos. 80, 97, 112-113, 130-131, 133, 137, 144-155
M37 S0B pos. 80, 87, 97, 102, 104, 114, 117, 121-122, 126, 131-132, 139-141

Dash Jet 2 bugs
These rooms have cosmetic Dash Jet 2 bugs:
M11 S13 pos. 130
M11 S3F pos. 132 (may as well call it an F6 trap - probably super-hard to get back out of)
M13 S4F pos. 101 (F6 trap if you DJ2 into it and release R/exhaust energy, fall into 117 below)
M23 S5E pos. 1, 17
M27 S5A pos. 77 (not sure if you mind players getting down where the non-enemy soldiers are standing around...)
M27 S5E pos. 43, 59, 75, 91 (again, can reach non-enemy soldiers here)

Other bugs
M1 S26: Bombable door could use an in-rock top combo (like S34 and S1B.)

M17 S79: Triggering secrets removes the combos at 67, 83 (so the platform disappears after defeating the boss.)

M19 S31: Not sure if a bug. You can shoot the switch from the left side of the room - wasn't sure if the blocks covering the hidden door are supposed to absorb your sidearm bullets, forcing approach from the top or right to trigger the switch.

M19 S69: F6 trap, I believe. If you come down here after getting GB1 but before DJB, you can get up over and down to the left side, but you cannot get back up out of the left side. I don't think. Even if I shoot my grapple beam into the ceiling to the right of the hookpoint, I can't pull myself high enough next to the ledge on the right to let go and move right onto it.

M19 S6F: Egg will not hatch when stunned.

M33 S7F: This Zodiac Interface lacks an energy field like the rest have.

M33 S49: This Warp Zone warp's field only extends 2 combos above the device instead of four combos all the way to the ceiling above (like the others.)

Boss Warps (Insta-Warp vs. w/Wave Effects)
So I'm guessing you originally implemented the Wave Effects warp to signify defeating a boss. But there's inconsistency in the game whether you use that or a normal Insta-Warp instead, when warping the player back to the Labyrinth screen (or the subsequent Inside Dmap screen, if it involves a cutscene.) They should probably be uniform, so I've made two lists of all the boss warps, so that if you wish to, you can choose whether to make them all one or the other, and then update the relevent list...

Insta-Warp (can be changed to "Insta-Warp with Wave Effects" instead):
M10 S13 (Explosives 1 boss)
M10 S1E (Supernova Armor boss)
M10 S27 (miniboss)
M10 S3C (Shield boss)
M10 S40 (High Jump boss)
M10 S42 (Disintegrator boss)
M10 S6F (Grapple Beam 1 boss)
M10 S72 (Voltiac Key boss)
M10 S7E (miniboss)

M25 S00 (Blackhole Armor boss)
M25 S07 (Iron fight #3)
M25 S10 (this poor miniboss has been cast aside - keep in mind if you place a new boss and/or reuse this screen for M17 S0D later.)
M25 S17 (Iron fight #5) (currently set to "Insta-Warp with Zap Effects" rather than "Insta-Warp")
M25 S30 (miniboss)
M25 S34 (Grapple Beam 2 boss)
M25 S35 (Libra Zodiac boss)
M25 S51 (Ship Jets 2 boss)
M25 S76 (Taurus Zodiac boss)
M25 S7F (miniboss)

M37 S10 (Ice Beam boss)
M37 S3E (Capricorn Zodiac boss)
M37 S3F (Stomp Boots boss)
M37 S45 (Zodiac Changer boss)
M37 S72 (Infinite Jump Boots boss)

M39 S30 (Leo Zodiac boss)

M46 S0F (Pulse Hammer boss)

ALTERNATIVELY...

Insta-Warp with Wave Effects (can be changed to "Insta-Warp" instead):
M10 S15 (Missile Launcher boss)
M10 S17 (Dash Jets 1 boss)
M10 S1A (Explosive Missiles boss)
M10 S45 (Iron fight #1)
M10 S48 (Iron fight #2)
M10 S49 (Aries Zodiac boss)
M10 S4A (Scorpio Zodiac boss)
M10 S58 (Cancer Zodiac boss)
M10 S79 (Gemini Zodiac boss)

M19 S55 (Aquarius Zodiac boss)

M25 S11 (Wall Cling Boots boss)
M25 S12 (miniboss)
M25 S14 (Repair Module 1 boss)
M25 S15 (Life Upgrade miniboss)
M25 S17 (Iron fight #5) (currently set to "Insta-Warp with Zap Effects" rather than "Insta-Warp with Wave Effects")
M25 S19 (Iron fight #4)
M25 S20 (Double Jump Boots boss)
M25 S23 (miniboss)
M25 S24 (Dash Jets 2 boss)
M25 S27 (Life Upgrade miniboss)
M25 S31 (miniboss)
M25 S32 (Pisces Zodiac boss)
M25 S40 (Virgo Zodiac boss)
M25 S51 (miniboss)

...And now I'm off to go watch that LP!

(ETA2: I did not bother to look at the Pandora. Don't think it has any doors/"caves" anyways and still haven't actually legitimately played it, so I don't want to spoil it for myself.)

Aquarius Bubble
If you press/hold Up while standing on a halftile row, you will not rise - only on fulltile rows (walking off the edge of a halftile row while holding up will cause you to drop a little and then begin rising diagonally.)

Inside the underwater terminal room M10 S07, I can only rise halfway up the screen - if I jump up into the top half of the screen and release L while inside the bubble and pressing Up, I'll slide back down to the middle row and hold there.

Probably no impact on game but it looks odd.

An audible "pop" and visual popping bubble graphic would still be cool.

Also, could you tweak the Capricorn Wave so the enemy eraser quickly expands a few concentric circles centered on your sprite, similar to the weapon's regular shot, in addition to the screen flashing? It would look a little cooler.

When you pick up a special item that freezes you while holding it up, you can hold R and press left/right to dash around while holding it up.

Edited by newstarshipsmell, 17 August 2015 - 01:38 AM.