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#1 Espilan

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Posted 29 April 2006 - 09:06 AM

I guess someone should point out a few things about 'feedback' on PureZC.
Here goes. Note that [item] may be anything available here on PureZC. Quests, tiles, music, you name it.

You can refer to THIS TOPIC if you need to, but I do NOT want to see any actual complaining about it or any of the posts in it. We don't need that little war continued in here.

1) Provide constructive positive feedback when possible.
If you like [item], try to tell [item]'s creator what you liked so much about it. It'll tell them to consider using it again in a later submission.
Example: If you like Mr. Z's block puzzles and you're reviewing a quest of his that uses them, tell him which ones in particular you enjoyed. Next thing you know, he'll do more block puzzles. icon_biggrin.gif

2) Provide constructive negative feedback when possible.
If you don't like [item], find what it is about [item] that turns you away from it and let the creator know. This way, they'll know to be careful when trying to do it again.
Example: I noticed some negative comments regarding the collaboration "I'm Busy!", where people did not like the fact that it was simply a percussion loop, even though I had stated in the description that it was such. Oulisa and I will probably avoid doing that sort of thing again. icon_sweat.gif

3) Have nothing helpful to say about something you don't like?
As Thibeinn learned recently, not backing up one's own comments when responding negatively to submitted content can be interpreted as an attack on the entire community, and as many people have noticed, the community (some of it, at least) responded as if it were a meaningless attack. Avoid doing this. Please. It's for your own good.
Example: CLICK HERE

4) What to consider...
As pointed out in a recent announcement on the site index, there are people who rate things based on screenshots or other forms of 'previewing' the content. This isn't what the creators want you to do if you rate them at all. See below:

4a) For quests, creators generally expect people to play at least halfway through before issuing some kind of rating, wanting their players to see how things in the quest work, not to have the players base their judgement on a handful of screenshots (or in some cases the music selected for the quest).

However, questmakers, due to the rather high standards of the community itself (not the staff), don't ignore preview screenshots entirely; they often determine if your quest will see many players.

4b) For tiles and tilesets, ratings should probably be based on how well the tiles look and work. This doesn't mean you can get away with seeing a few screenshots using these tiles and basing your rating on that, though. What you should do first is try to use them yourself:

Are they really usable, as long as they're not too hard?
Do the ones that animate animate well?
Does that outfit make Link look fat? Some people don't like playing a quest where Link looks weird.
Are they recolors or straight rips from a ROM or other source? These seem to be frowned upon due to how easy they seem to be. Be careful when submitting them.

4c) For music submissions, I can't really repeat the 'preview' bit here, because most of us in PureZC's music industry (icon_razz.gif) usually don't include preview clips. However, I can offer some things to consider if you're going to go rate something:

Does everything sound right to you?
Is it too loud? Is it too quiet?
If it is a Tracker submission and it loops, does the loop happen at the right time?
If it is a MIDI submission, is the extention 'MID'? Zelda Classic can't use the 'RMI' format. (I made that mistake once or twice.)

4d) For all three of the above, read the description and any included readmes in the package zip. Sometimes, [item]'s creator will want to warn you ahead of time for something you may not like about their submission. It doesn't help them when you ignore this and harp on them for something they did address by notifying you of it.

Edited by Espilan, 06 May 2006 - 09:56 AM.


#2 Sacred Nym

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Posted 29 April 2006 - 09:26 AM

I see... this topic being pinned in the near future.

[/fortune teller act]

This is a great topic to hopefully prevent something like what happened to Thibeinn

#3 elise

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Posted 29 April 2006 - 09:50 AM

QUOTE(Questions @ Apr 29 2006, 04:26 PM)
This is a great topic to hopefully prevent something like what happened to Thibeinn

View Post


Nothing happened to Thibeinn
Thibeinn caused something , with the way he made that thread .
He still doesn't say what his problem is/was , he did alot of blahblah and said nothing .
The ones that asked to point out his problem aren't the ones that where wrong
Theibin was wrong.
If he had made a thread like Espilan point out here ,then nothing would have happened to him
don't make him the victim icon_wink.gif

Edited by elise, 29 April 2006 - 09:51 AM.


#4 Sacred Nym

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Posted 29 April 2006 - 10:04 AM

The point was made that's all I have to say.

#5 Freedom

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Posted 29 April 2006 - 10:09 AM

Elises's point was made too, hers I agree with. icon_wink.gif

#6 ShadowTiger

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Posted 29 April 2006 - 08:18 PM

Indeed. icon_razz.gif Sounds to me like this is a topic worthy of being pinned. Thoughts?

... Well I'll just go ahead and pin this then. Staff, feel free to unpin at your leisure.

#7 Theryan

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Posted 29 April 2006 - 09:55 PM

Theibin just stated he didn't like any of the quests he had played. As soon as I read his posts my mind said things like, "So?", "WTF?", "Why did you post that?", "Just quit now...".

I didn't say any of that because it could have been consider flaming icon_heh.gif
Better safe than sorry

He said nothing to help any questmakers, making it seem as tough he was trying to make himself look good.

Edited by theryan, 29 April 2006 - 09:57 PM.


#8 shadowfall1976

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Posted 02 May 2006 - 03:39 PM

I agree with everyone that posted there against him I am 30, I make quests when I get the time
I try hard to get them bug free, but to no avail, that is why I made my own site for downloads, not
to tie up submissions here all the times I find a bug and fix it. I accept any help on making my quests better
and there are countless posts here & other sites that state bugs to my quests, I am happy to fix when
I get the time, and I could truly care less if someone don't like my quests, there are people that do and
I will make quests for them.

whoever don't like them, don't bother saying so, unless you have a bug fix for me.

believe me if I find a problem that I can't play through i'd ask for assistance, and if nothing else
I would PM the creator. people should accept open critisism, as most of you here do well, but I can see
why you could be offended by him.

I openly ask for help in finding bugs, I know in my time schedule, I don't habe the proper time to
search everywhere for them, I play the game through over and over, and I still have people tell
me that there are ones I missed, so what, I fix them and move on to the next, I don't get offended.
that is another reason I started my own site, so I can release Beta's and have them tested without
holding anyone up here.

I come here every once in a while to check on new tiles & quests, I will say I don't like every quest I played
from here, but I do appreiciate the time everyone spends on them. and to say that I mean no disrespect
as I am sure not everyone likes my quests. I am not here to put anyone down for even the simplest quest
they might make, they still put time and effort into it.

everyone let's help each other make better quests......
as I know ther you all have been doing and doing well, the help you guys provide is why I come here.

and I thank everyone who has played my quests and rated me, however undeserved I feel it may be.

I may not have that many posts but I have been here a long time, 3 years almost, so I do have a certain amount
of respect for everyone here, we are all here to pay homage to a game we all love.

Edited by shadowfall1976, 02 May 2006 - 03:49 PM.


#9 Espilan

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Posted 06 May 2006 - 10:01 AM

QUOTE(shadowfall1976 @ May 2 2006, 03:39 PM)
(the whole above post)

...icon_blink.gif...

I love you. (Not in THAT way.)

Also:
user posted image


I've come up with something else to add to my list at the beginning of this topic. Go look, please.

#10 NoeL

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Posted 08 July 2006 - 10:52 AM

(reads the whole Theibin topic)

Heh heh... that guy's a dick icon_razz.gif Obviously didn't even play any quests since he couldn't name them. Did he end up getting banned or what? This is why I boycotted the forums for so long, too many dickweeds out to make trouble (excuse the French).

Oh, and also
QUOTE(Espilan @ May 6 2006, 09:01 AM)
...icon_blink.gif...

I love you. (Not in THAT way.)

View Post


Ditto.

Edited by NoeL, 08 July 2006 - 10:57 AM.


#11 Bonegolem

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Posted 30 July 2006 - 08:22 PM

Hey, what would you expect from a guy who has Megalon as their avatar? (Regarding point #3) For those Godzilla fans.. >.>b

I wish people who make these "Every Custom Quest sux!" threads would just not make the thread in the first place. It could discourage new quest makers who could become really great.

#12 James24

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Posted 11 March 2007 - 04:25 AM

QUOTE(Bonegolem @ Jul 30 2006, 07:22 PM) View Post

Hey, what would you expect from a guy who has Megalon as their avatar? (Regarding point #3) For those Godzilla fans.. >.>b

I wish people who make these "Every Custom Quest sux!" threads would just not make the thread in the first place. It could discourage new quest makers who could become really great.


I'm a new quest maker who just read the whole Thibeinn saga and I can say I'm not discouraged. I agree with everyone who posted again Thibeinn. There really should have been constructive feedback. If Thibeinn was worried about offending the creators by openly criticizing their quest, he could've saught PM approval from the creators before posting (which I'm sure that at least 1/6 would be OK with).

That said, I can also understand Thibeinn's frustration. A few days ago, I starting using ZQuest and it was very frustrating not knowing the first thing about making a quest. I didn't even know how to place an item and the solution was that a page down key had to be pressed first. How unintuitive and frustrating. For a newcomer to learn how to play ZC would not be easy and it can be frustrating. But its like anything else in life, no pain - no gain.

Don't get me wrong, I am immensely grateful to PM, ZC developers and all the custom quest creators who donated their spare time making something which I have enjoyed since I was a kid. My quest will give something back to the community and its also very fun to be in charge for once. My tastes though are somewhat...eccentric... and I don't know how well my new ideas will be received. We'll see.

#13 trudatman

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Posted 28 December 2008 - 06:03 PM

QUOTE(Espilan @ Apr 29 2006, 09:06 AM) View Post
....For quests, creators generally expect people to play at least halfway through before issuing some kind of rating....not to have the players base their judgement on a handful of screenshots....

is this a hard and fast rule enough that Lord Ike's useless diss on my quest (see: http://www.purezc.co...ge=quests&id=65 ) can/should/will be deleted from the reviews of HowHigh.qst? he hurts my average rating by giving it a 3/5. his comments don't help anybody considering playing it. he didn't even download it to try it for a minute; his review is based on almost nothing. bias, uncalled for, hurts. I'd be appreciative if a staff member would delete his review. thanks for reading this.

#14 Marco

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Posted 28 December 2008 - 06:47 PM

Everyone has diffrent opinions and thoughts, trudatman.

First off, We all have to live with the ratings in the database. I have mixed ratings for my tiles and tileset, some I applaud and dislike, but I cant help it. YES, some people, I can tell, just gave me an awnser without even trying out the ZC work I created. Thing is, everyone has a right? to have a say in the database. As long as you dont flame Just fallow the rules of Pzc, your comment will be granted.

Next, Im not sure if you are trying to gain more awareness for your quest, but I had every right to say that. I gave it my appeal, my thoughts, and its not like I said " boo. I dont have 1.90, and it looks @*&#(@! ) No, I wasn't dissing. I judged from the resources I had ( screenshots and previous comments ) and gave it my best.

Sure, We would all like it if people would actually try out our work, before they judge. Truth is, if you have the right tools for the job, do the work correct. If you lack and minus the effort, you get the real world. ( If you have the ZC fir the quest, play it then have a say. If you dont have the ZC, then at least be fair and give an honest opinion. And thats what I did. And as for the players, other than me ( but I didnt play so.. ) if they look at my comment, they shouldnt be afraid. I didn't say there were bugs, errors, and poor quality. I said, its appealing to me. Thats all.

#15 Mitchfork

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Posted 28 December 2008 - 07:10 PM

Lord Ike, you can't judge a quest unless you've played it. It's like a food judge saying "Well, I can't eat this, but I think it would be okay if I did, so you get a 3/5." If you don't have 1.90, you can't judge quests released for that version. Regardless of whether the comment was positive or negative, the fact is that you've judged something that you have no basis to judge.

That said, I am going to go ahead and tell all parties that the discussion is over. I don't want to see any flaming here, so any further discussion about the comment in question is prohibited. Trudatman, I will bring up your request with the rest of the staff and we'll decide what to do.


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