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Brown & Tan colors in Pure Overworld Palletes:


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#1 ShadowTiger

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Posted 27 October 2004 - 07:18 PM

Okay. Here's an odd idea for the Pure Set Palletes. (Not necessarily for the Pure Set itself.) I just need your opinions on it.


Okay. You know how the three overworld Csets (2-4, Level Pallete 0, and other variations.) have a set of three brown colors in each of the Csets? Well, imagine if in one of those Csets, ... say.. the Cset where the grass turns white, I turn the brown colors into a fleshy tan, similar to that of light beach sand.

The good thing about this is that you can now have real sand which doesn't look like brown slated sand. I mean, it's another variation on cliffs you can use! O_O

... But, the primary negative point to this, is that for the white Cset, you'll have to layer the tops of trees onto them, because the rest of the trees will be white like this in that Cset, now that those (tree)brown colors will be lighter.

I should show you a screenshot soon. In the meantime, try to make the best with what I've given you. icon_wink.gif For a bit of imagery, try to imagine this. When you press the keypad + or - in ZQuest to change the combo page's Cset, you can imagine the cliffs, tree trunks, all turning much lighter, to that white sandy color.



So what do you think?

#2 Radien

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Posted 28 October 2004 - 05:48 PM

Well, I've found that layering sometimes isn't worth the trouble... but I'd like to see what this "white sand" you speak of looks like. It might be possible apply this solely to level palettes that require sand. Unlike dirt, you don't necessarily find sand everywhere, eh?

Since it's so appropriate to the topic, I took a screenshot of the new Pure palette I've worked out. It works pretty well, I'd say. icon_smile.gif

user posted image

Seeing as the "flower" colors served no purpose except to be bright, I took them out, leaving the whites (which are sometimes used for water tiles) and one of the blues (it's important to have one shade of blue in CSet 2 which matches the color of a standard water tile).

I used the extra space to add one shade of brown... but since it needed to be darker than the ones already there, I shifted the entire brown gradient one slot to the left. I had to recolor all of my tiles to do this, but once the bulk was done it worked quite nicely. icon_smile.gif Ripped tiles still work in the new CSets; they're just a bit darker unless you recolor them, and the rarely-used "flower" colors should be replaced with bright colors from the gradient furthest to the right.

Overall I find this palette gives me far more freedom than it does limitations. It's like halfway between Pure and Descendant for flexibility and ease-of-use. icon_thumbsup.gif

P.S. -
I forgot to mention that I included CSet 5. Now, you can use this CSet for whatever you want, but by default in Pure it's used for the menu frames, plus a few of the "misc. colors" in the Quest -> Graphics menu. If you aren't using the default menus, all you need do is reassign the "misc. colors" which use colors from CSet 5, and create a CSet to use for your own menu frames. The reason mine resembles the overworld CSets is because I'm using a leafy menu frame with brown map outlines. icon_smile.gif

Edited by Radien, 28 October 2004 - 05:53 PM.


#3 ShadowTiger

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Posted 28 October 2004 - 09:06 PM

........ I should really just use Cset 5 for... hey, no, that won't work. What if I want variations of it? What if there are night time, or armageddon palletes! O_O It's not exactly the most reliable thing in the world, relying on ... *Drools at the thought of a reddish Color-Cycled Armageddon scene. icon_drool.gif * ... icon_blink.gif Sorry, .. relying on a very solid Cset which doesn't change for such things.

#4 Radien

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Posted 31 October 2004 - 05:30 PM

Hey, I've been working on more alternate palettes. icon_smile.gif I wanted to run one by you. Here's the most recent thing I've come up with. Below, in order, are three sample CSets: overworld, dungeon, and sprites.

user posted image

Here's what the colors represent:

OVERWORLD
1 transparency, 1 white (constant), 4 treetop greens (switches to grey or blue), 3 autumn auburns (switches to purple or burgundy), 4 browns (constant), 2 grass greens (constant), and 1 black (constant).

DUNGEON
1 transparency, 5 wall colors (in this case green), 3 greys (constant), 4 browns/yellows (constant), 2 torch colors, and 1 black (constant).

SPRITES
The uses vary, but here's a typical usage:
1 transparency, 1 white (constant), 1 yellow (constant), 3 primary color, 3 secondary color, 3 grey/fleshtones (semi-constant), 1 red (constant), 2 oddball colors, and 1 black (constant).


This layout is partially compatible with Pure; mostly the Overworld palette.

Edited by Radien, 31 October 2004 - 05:33 PM.


#5 ShadowTiger

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Posted 01 November 2004 - 03:24 PM

... Hm. And these, ... are these consistant with Csets 2, 3, and 4? Or will these be general concepts for new Palletes? ... Because I think those are darn cool, Radien. icon_smile.gif


.. Now... I had a few recommendations, but I pretty much answered them all myself through further thought. I'm not sure if you had the same thoughts though, but .. since you made them, I have only but to assume you had. icon_shrug.gif

#6 Radien

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Posted 01 November 2004 - 04:46 PM

Well, they're partially similar to Pure.

You see the first palette I posted? Okay... drop the darkest brown and move the remaining browns one space to the right. Move both whites over one space, as well. Then fill in the empty spaces with "flower" colors. (Oh, and ignore CSet 5.) Then you have Pure.

In the second palette I posted, the browns are Pure-compatible when ripping, and the one black is the same, but everything else is shifted around a bit.

Recommendations? Oh, go ahead, I wanna hear 'em. icon_smile.gif I've been tossing about ideas for the past few days, but that doesn't mean I've considered every possibility.

Edited by Radien, 01 November 2004 - 04:49 PM.


#7 ChaoticGood1

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Posted 30 November 2004 - 10:57 PM

I have been working on a new palette for a few days now and have come up with a very versitle palette compatible with nearly all combos. It looks very similar to the New Pure Tileset shown in Radien's first post, almost exact actually. Containing a 4 shades of a color, followed by a set of 2 shades of green, 4 shades of brown, 4 shades of another color and a black. When matched up and colored correctly it has enabled all combos (except 6) to be completly compatible with each other, including enimies. It could use a little tweaking and I may set it up to utilize a white by tweaking with cset 6 a bit.

#8 Radien

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Posted 30 November 2004 - 11:32 PM

Wow, you're right, ChaoticGood. icon_smile.gif That's exactly what my overworld palette consists of, except I only have three shades of the secondary color and one standalone color for white and other catch-all uses. However, chances are the order is quite different. You see the last palette above? I've rearranged that exact same selection of colors to a quite different order.

Right now, I've finalized my dungeon and overworld palettes. My next concern is what I should do with the sprite palettes. They are in a semi-predictable layout, but they're not functional in the same way. And since CSets 7 through 11 in BS are very much the default in the ZC community, I may have to rethink it again.

Want a picture of the newest palette? How about yours, "CG?" icon_smile.gif

#9 ChaoticGood1

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Posted 30 November 2004 - 11:43 PM

I'd love to show you my palette, however I do not know how to take a snapshot of it. =P So if ya wanna impart some wisdom as to how, ill gladly show you what I've come up with

#10 link3505

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Posted 30 November 2004 - 11:48 PM

take a snapshot with F12 (in the tile editor) or Z (in the main window), and upload the BMP. it's easy to view the pallete from there. just make it CSet 0 (don't save if it over-writes another CSet)

#11 ChaoticGood1

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Posted 01 December 2004 - 12:24 AM

Heres an Example of how I am organizing my Palletes, Just 3 csets from 0-5. Cset 6 has some slight alterations but keeps the same scheme, and Cset 7-8 are also more or less the same. I havent fully worked out cset 9, but if all goes well I will be able to keep the same formula. (Its been awhile since i worked on ZC so I have to get back into touch with how alot of the things work all over again.)

Edit: Its not very compatible with anything, I am in the process of recoloring and reconfiguring all the tiles from Pure, Decendant and anything else I can get my hands on that look like it could be useful for the average ZC user. I also have not tried using it in any dungeons Palettes or anything other than main (I have also re-done most the Extra Sprite Palletes), as I have not gotten to recoloring the dungeon walls ect. However when I do, I dont foresee any problems.

user posted image

Edited by ChaoticGood1, 01 December 2004 - 12:29 AM.


#12 Radien

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Posted 01 December 2004 - 04:44 AM

Ahh, okay, CG. I see you don't use greys, exactly; those appear to be greenish greys... This palette looks specialized. That is actually a good thing. icon_smile.gif Variety is nice.


Now, on to this picture I made... Phew! This took awhile, but I'm pretty sure I won't be changing anything on it for quite awhile.

Here's my palette layout, and a concise listing of which groups of colors work as a set, and what they are used for. The organization goes like this:

1 (Transp.) / 1 + 4 / 4 / 2 / 3 / 1


user posted image

What do you think? icon_smile.gif It may be possible to organize your set this way, if you like it. The organization is what's important; what types of colors you put it in it is secondary.

#13 ShadowTiger

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Posted 01 December 2004 - 12:33 PM

You can't include another purple for the dungeon walls, Radien? :\

Otherwise, we're quite flabbergasted, I assure you.

#14 ChaoticGood1

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Posted 01 December 2004 - 04:25 PM

I do have a gray set its is just not shown in what I put up. Im not sure axactly what set of Colors I will use for which Cset. I am still learning and Im sure I will end up revising my pallete once again once I start re-coloring more tiles and seting up level palletes. As for your cset looks very good and it seems you have a whole lot of versatility in your set (as well as alot of thought for what things will be used for.) I can picture your set being incredible with the correct use of Level palletes and such. And im glad to have seen it as it gave me some insight as to what I may want to change in mine.

#15 Radien

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Posted 01 December 2004 - 07:03 PM

BH4:

What in the world would you use a sixth purple for? icon_eek.gif Yes, there are five shades of dungeon colors in the current palette... the last one is very dark, but it's not black.

CG:

Thank you. icon_smile.gif Yeah, it took quite awhile to figure this out... By the way, I should mention that this color layout WOULD be much more compatible with Pure, if it were not for some things which are hard-coded into ZQuest.

ZC assumes you've set color #1 in CSet 0 to white. It is used for various miscellaneous text. So if I wanted CSet 0 to fit the DoR standard -- and I do -- then I had to edge in on the space once used for primary colors.

White also had to be next to the browns, because in the dungeon palettes, I drop white and replace it with a 5th dungeon wall color.

Edited by Radien, 01 December 2004 - 10:20 PM.



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