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Lava causing Burn Status Inquiry


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Poll: Lava causing Burn Status Inquiry

After being warped by lava to the beginning of the screen, is burn status a good idea?

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#1 NewJourneysFire

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Posted 17 September 2019 - 01:29 PM

Please read the question and share your thoughts and provide your answer in the poll.

Moosh elaborates the nature of the discussion below, I'll just quote it here:
 

So since NJF didn't put the reason for this debate in the OP, here's my reasoning.
 
The fact that falling in lava teleports the player back to the start of the screen to creates a disconnect between gameplay and logic. 
 
If it's a game where you can walk through lava and take damage then in that case it makes sense that you'd catch on fire. But when the game teleports you, I think that's the game's way of saying "No, that didn't just happen. If that happened you would die." So because the game is undoing something that shouldn't have happened it makes no sense for there to be consequences for it. It makes no sense for the player to catch fire after falling in lava, just like you wouldn't have a floating sky castle have pits that drop the player somewhere on the overworld.


My question is, would this be a gimmick you'd be for (assuming the effect is not too punishing or it builds up or is inflicted randomly), or would it be too logically absurd (taking Moosh's explanation into account).



#2 Anthus

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Posted 17 September 2019 - 01:34 PM

I voted No. Assuming lava already damages you. It could work if the effect was temporary. Generally I'm not a fan of those types of mechanics in an action setting. If you already have burn damage then it's up to you. I'd still play it btw it's not a deal breaker for me.

#3 Moosh

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Posted 17 September 2019 - 01:36 PM

So since NJF didn't put the reason for this debate in the OP, here's my reasoning.

 

The fact that falling in lava teleports the player back to the start of the screen to creates a disconnect between gameplay and logic. 

 

If it's a game where you can walk through lava and take damage then in that case it makes sense that you'd catch on fire. But when the game teleports you, I think that's the game's way of saying "No, that didn't just happen. If that happened you would die." So because the game is undoing something that shouldn't have happened it makes no sense for there to be consequences for it. It makes no sense for the player to catch fire after falling in lava, just like you wouldn't have a floating sky castle have pits that drop the player somewhere on the overworld. 

 

Edit: Now I realize following my own logic, lava shouldn't deal damage after it teleports the player. That I think is a concession games make for gameplay reasons. But I realize it could just as easily turn my own reasoning against me. :P


Edited by Moosh, 17 September 2019 - 01:41 PM.

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#4 NewJourneysFire

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Posted 17 September 2019 - 01:44 PM

I voted No. Assuming lava already damages you. It could work if the effect was temporary. Generally I'm not a fan of those types of mechanics in an action setting. If you already have burn damage then it's up to you. I'd still play it btw it's not a deal breaker for me.

What if the burn effect is:
1 - Not that punishing.
2 - Not instant (could be randomized chance or a build up effect).

Edit: Now I realize following my own logic, lava shouldn't deal damage after it teleports the player. That I think is a concession games make for gameplay reasons. But I realize it could just as easily turn my own reasoning against me. :P

I am a monster.



#5 ShadowTiger

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Posted 17 September 2019 - 02:57 PM

I think it depends on the quest's need.

Imagine if your shield could burn or not, and you need your shield present to block a laser beam shooting at you from above a door-frame you need to pass through.  If you get burned in the lava, you can't go through the door.  If you get a metal shield, however, you're fine.  So that's one dungeon mechanic.

 

If the lava doesn't burn you, and it acts like a standard "pit" that you vanish into and restart at the beginning of the room, then the lava's appearance is basically just decorative.  The point of damage you take is either optional, or it serves as a little flick on the wrist telling you "Be more careful / get gud son."

Otherwise, what is this "burn status" that I'm reading about here?  Is it assumed condition, or a pre-defined thing that people are talking about but introduced somewhere else on the forums? O.o



#6 NewJourneysFire

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Posted 17 September 2019 - 03:06 PM

Should have elaborated that it's a scripted status that does damage over time. 


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#7 P-Tux7

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Posted 17 September 2019 - 11:51 PM

I don't care. It's Zelda. It's already weird that some pits teleport you to the lower floor and some just reset the room. Same goes with water, you logically shouldn't drown and should just climb back to where you dropped off. LTTP actually does this before you get the flippers. But the later games added it because having to avoid tiles that reset you to the door you entered and take some damage is a fun challenge that keeps you looking where you're walking but isn't punishing. Also let me remind you again this is Zelda, the series where a magic train spike can turn Demise into a mouth with legs. Zelda makes absolutely no sense and everyone here has already forgiven it for that, so forgive yourself.
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#8 Alucard648

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Posted 18 September 2019 - 10:08 AM

In my quest, falling into water (wothout flippers) or lava is genuine instant death. How about it?


Edited by Alucard648, 18 September 2019 - 10:11 AM.


#9 P-Tux7

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Posted 18 September 2019 - 11:37 AM

In my quest, falling into water (wothout flippers) or lava is genuine instant death. How about it?


Not ideal, especially if enemies give knockback. I'm pretty sure your quest is sideview but that's still annoying.
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#10 Dimentio

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Posted 23 September 2019 - 10:42 PM

In my quest, falling into water (wothout flippers) or lava is genuine instant death. How about it?

Instant death doesn't make your game harder, it just makes it more punishing which makes it more annoying for players to return to where they died. Death count means nothing to how enjoyable or how difficult your quest is.




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