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How many items are too many items?


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#1 idontknow8

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Posted 26 July 2016 - 02:01 PM

Is there such thing as having too many items in your inventory?

 

I'm debating having 15 regular, non-scripted items (the bow/arrow, boomerang, whistle, hammer, etc.) PLUS an additional 11 SCRIPTED items.  Those items are as follows:

 

-Bombchu:  Remote control rat that speeds off in direction link faces & explodes on impact with wall or enemy (can later be upgraded to change direction remotely)

 

-Dominion Rod:  Breathe life into otherwise lifeless statues.  Take control of them and even use them to help defeat enemies & solve puzzles.

 

-Ice Staff:  Create ice magic that can freeze water & lava to safely cross. Also traps enemies in ice and extinguishes flames in one shot.

 

-Thunder Boots:  Link jumps into the air and then pounds the ground, shaking the screen and producing lightening bolts that radiate from where he lands (can be upgraded to produce bigger jump, more powerful pound)

 

-Bombos Medallion:  A powerful spell that consumes lots of magic to produce explosions all around Link, doing heavy damage to enemies.  An optional item gained only after completing a difficult side quest.

 

-Invisibility Cloak:  Do a quick dash and become invisible for short period of time.

 

-Shiekah Stone (warp doll):  Use once to place it.  Use it again and the screen will quickly flash and then Link and the stone switch places.

 

-Deku Leaf:  Shoot forward gusts of wind used to knock back enemies (but doesn't damage them). Also used to power turbines that need some extra oomph to get them started.

 

-Duel-A-Rang:  Shoot two boomerangs at once at 45 degree angles from Link.  Does stun enemies but do retrieve items and damage enemies.  A fun -and useful - optional item gained as a reward after completing a certain task.

 

-Sand Wand:  Use this to harden piles of sand into blocks that can be pushed to solve puzzles.

 

-Stop Watch:  Stop traps in their tracks for six seconds. (can be upgraded to last longer)

 

Therefore we have a total of 26 USEABLE items/weapon, not even counting the sword & all equipment items (bomb bags, wallets, etc.)  Would probably have 2 in each dungeon, plus a few leftover to find or buy in the overworld.  Thoughts???


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#2 coolgamer012345

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Posted 26 July 2016 - 02:04 PM

I don't think it's an issue as long as the items don't feel useless (eg. if you only use them in a single dungeon, and realistically never again throughout the rest of the quest)


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#3 KingPridenia

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Posted 26 July 2016 - 02:14 PM

Blue pretty much said what I was going to. As long as you don't have useless items that get ONE use then it never sees the light of day again, you should be fine. Also try to avoid any repetition, such as the five different swords from Randomizer (although Randomizer I can let slide due to its nature, but still).



#4 Cukeman

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Posted 26 July 2016 - 02:41 PM

Forgetting custom items for the moment, I wouldn't make it so that Link could hold every default ZC item in a quest because there are so many powerful items that it becomes like playing in God mode. I say limit the player to just a very small number of powerful items, or make it so that you can choose between them and exchange one powerful item for another at an item exchange location.


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#5 idontknow8

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Posted 26 July 2016 - 02:56 PM

Cukeman:

 

Yeah, I agree.  There have been numerous items added to Zquest, many that aren't even in an actual Zelda game, that make the game far too easy, or certain obstacles absolute, namely...

 

Fire B'Rang

Golden Ring

Super Quake Scroll

Heart Rings

Magic Rings

Infinite Wallet, Bomb Bag & Quiver

Whisp Ring

Wealth Medallion (25%)

Level 4 / Master Sword

Golden Arrow

1/2 Magic Upgrade

 

I plan to not use any of these.  I will have a "Golden Arrow" but it will actually be only the level 2 / Silver Arrow, just disguised to look like the Golden Arrow but not as powerful as the true Golden Arrow, for sake of the story.  I will have special rewards that make the game a LITTLE easier (like the 75% wealth medal, Level 2 & 3 swords, Peril beam scroll, & charge ring), but don't totally break the game.


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#6 Timelord

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Posted 26 July 2016 - 03:22 PM

I personally love item-heavy quests. Look at how much Randomiser doles out, and consider that the items make the game fun.


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#7 CyberGamer1539

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Posted 26 July 2016 - 03:42 PM

Yeah, I like to collect lots of things, so I like Randomizer. However, unless your quest DOES happen to be a massive collect-a-thon, then I'd say limiting the uber-powerful items is a good call.


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#8 Shane

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Posted 26 July 2016 - 04:24 PM

As long as you have good uses for each and every item you should be okay. Don't be a Twilight Princess. Twilight Princess spoiled us with really cool items that never got much use outside their dungeons and a few small specific locations in the overworld. :(


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#9 Lüt

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Posted 26 July 2016 - 04:50 PM

How many items are too many items?

 

I don't know, 8?

 

...

 

OK, shoot me.

 

Generally, I'll agree with Sh... Polaris. I love big inventories, but you have to walk the line between variety and clutter, and if you have both creative items and multiple opportunities to use them, then you can stay on the variety side even with a huge item selection.

 

Most of your new ones sound useful, and could provide a wide variety of design possibilities if used adequately. The only one I question is the invisibility cloak - are there enemies or objects that "see" you, which you could benefit by hiding from? For example, stepping past those laser-shooting wall-eyes from LttP? Or the beamos statues, for that matter? Perhaps projectile-shooting enemies not being able to see you and therefore refraining from shooting projectiles at all? Maybe even do it Doom-style and have all the projectiles fire haphazardly?

 

I see lots of potential in all of them, so I say, if you've got good and consistent uses for them, then go ahead and add all of them.


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#10 symbiote01

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Posted 26 July 2016 - 05:16 PM

I don't think it's an issue as long as the items don't feel useless (eg. if you only use them in a single dungeon, and realistically never again throughout the rest of the quest)

 

But aren't one-use items a staple of Zelda games?

 

Bait (LoZ), letter (LoZ), whistle (AoL), Bombos (LttP), toadstool (OoT), the slingshot (OoT), biggoron's sword (OoT), several masks (MM), the gilded sword (MM)... the list goes on and on.  The trick is to put limited-use items towards the end of the game, so you don't feel like you're carting it around over half the world for no reason.

 

Personally, I use the 'can choose A and B items' rule and love to find ways to put them together.  And I've added a few weapon scrolls: "dash attack" when you have Pegasus Boots + Sword equipped; "bomb arrows" with the bow + regular bombs; "down stab" if you use the sword (while in the air from the feather).

 

I've also got five 'songs' for very specific tasks: Song of Secrets for certain on-screen secrets, Song of Disruption to kill a certain enemy, Song of Calling to call Epona, Song of Pickles to turn potions (and certain fires) green; and Song of Nothing that... well, does nothing??

 

That said, my current project has a ridiculous amount of items to collect, many of them sorta superfluous.  A 'Blink' item that teleports you to a random location two or three steps away (useful for getting to areas you just can't.quite.reach) but can also hurt you (if you tp into a solid object/off a cliff/into water).  A ball and chain weapon (that is probably a little OP) because why not?  A shovel item that serves little purpose but to let you dig for rupees (and safely dig up bombflowers).  And the ability to call Epona is cool and all (and pretty speedy), but not terribly practical for a game that moves screen-to-screen on sometimes narrow paths.

 

Technically the hookshot is just an orthogonal boomerang unless you have a hookshot target handy (or against enemies specifically vulnerable to it). In the original LoZ, the book was useless unless you also had the wand, and the bow or the arrow didn't help unless you had them both (and some rupees to spare).


Edited by symbiote01, 26 July 2016 - 05:19 PM.

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#11 idontknow8

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Posted 26 July 2016 - 06:09 PM

The invisibility cloak actually has two functions - It makes Link dash forward but also while dashing, he is invisible.  So, I'm think that there will be "statues" (for lack of a better word) that "see" Link when he's directly lined up with them in any of the four cardinal directions.  When this happens, certain blocks pop up, preventing him from progressing further (using step triggers or step->next combos).  However, if you use the invisibility cloak, you can dash past these statues (and over these triggers without triggering them) and then progress.  You could also use this in combat to quickly speed past enemies or around the room.



#12 idontknow8

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Posted 26 July 2016 - 06:31 PM

Also, sort of on topic - thinking of having multiple types of potions, though you can always only carry & use one at a time (because Link will only have one bottle to store a potion in).  Debating having the following potions:

 

-Milk:  Restores five hearts

-Mana Milk:  Restores 32mp

-Mushroom Soup:  Restores four hearts & 64mp

-Explosive Elixir:  Gives Link four bombs but at the expense of doing 4 hearts damage

-Gibdo Juice:  Gives Link the same effect as a clock, freezing all enemies & making him invincible, for 10 seconds but disables use of sword

-Red Potion:  Refills all hearts

-Green Potion:  Refills all magic

-Blue Potion:  Refills all hearts & magic (must do a side quest to unlock this


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#13 Timelord

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Posted 26 July 2016 - 11:07 PM

One thing that I like to do, is allow the player to retain, and use 'Lower Level Items'.

The L1 boomerang, Short Hookshot, and such, are good examples, as they return faster. This additional varied selection gives the player more choices, and allows them the freedom to enjoy whichever they prefer. If a more powerful wand uses more MP, I let them keep the lesser one too. That sort of thing.

Eppy is especially in love with how I do this. :)

I also like inserting extremely well hidden, and obscure items in quests that are OP. Items that need to be 'assembled' from other items, are also interesting, and I've done that for two quests...or possibly three. (My 'Futhark' header is an example of how to make assembled items.)

In the end, more items make a more diverse game, but it can be prudent to make a custom subscreen to handle them, on multiple pages, or with extra submenus, like the bottles in the Z3 subscreen.
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#14 LikeLike on fire

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Posted 18 January 2017 - 06:27 AM

Also, sort of on topic - thinking of having multiple types of potions, though you can always only carry & use one at a time (because Link will only have one bottle to store a potion in).  Debating having the following potions:

 

-Milk:  Restores five hearts

-Mana Milk:  Restores 32mp

-Mushroom Soup:  Restores four hearts & 64mp

-Explosive Elixir:  Gives Link four bombs but at the expense of doing 4 hearts damage

-Gibdo Juice:  Gives Link the same effect as a clock, freezing all enemies & making him invincible, for 10 seconds but disables use of sword

-Red Potion:  Refills all hearts

-Green Potion:  Refills all magic

-Blue Potion:  Refills all hearts & magic (must do a side quest to unlock this

my like like quest was to have something like that, potions , some juice as potion before you get the letter. but they don't do much healing. but setting them up is confusing



#15 Beefster

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Posted 24 May 2017 - 01:37 PM

It can be amazing if you do it right. Zelda games have been on both ends of the spectrum. BotW has tons of different stuff in your inventory, sure, but fundamentally only has 4 items- the runes you get on the Plateau. On the other end, Majora's Mask has 24 masks (around half of which are useful in most situations), 15 items, and plenty of bottle contents and sidequest items and is easily one of my favorites.

 

I'm generally a fan of simplicity and subtractive design. Ask yourself, "Which of these items do I really need in my game?" If all of those 26 items have a purpose and none are in the game solely because it would be cool, you won't have a problem. If half of those items are shoehorned in and really don't benefit gameplay, it's just unnecessary complexity that will hurt your game. You don't have to use every item in ZC and you probably shouldn't.




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