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ZC Item Ranking

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Poll: ZC Item Ranking

Which ZC items are the best?

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#1 Sheik

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Posted 06 July 2017 - 01:17 PM

From the ZC Enemy Difficulty topic, quoting myself:
 

Thanks for the thoughtful replies everybody. Reading them made me realize that there should also be a "best/most useful/most powerful ZC item" poll, too. Anybody up to the task of setting one up? ;)

In the ZC Enemy Difficulty discussion numerous posts pointed out that the difficulty of enemies is relative to the available gear. So I came to wonder: Which ZC item do you consider most powerful, most useful? Why? In which scenarios?

 


Edited by Sheik, 06 July 2017 - 01:18 PM.


#2 Dark Ice Dragon

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Posted 06 July 2017 - 01:49 PM

Well, all the swords, is true that you might fight whitout it but you may cut grass and bush for take rupees and hearts even whit a low level sword

The Mirror Shield : the like link cannot eat it, once you have it you don't need to buy another shield and is the best  for kill Wizzrobes

The flippers : in the first quest you don't need it, but in many quest the overwolrds are full of water and flippers are a big help.

Hammer :  high attack, the possibility to destroy the shields and obstacles, is almost too powerful


Edited by Dark Ice Dragon, 06 July 2017 - 01:50 PM.

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#3 Jamian

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Posted 06 July 2017 - 02:45 PM

Of course, it all depends on the quest: the enemies you encounter, the other items in the item pool, etc.

 

But in general, if we're talking about a regular quest, I find that the most basic Z1 items are the most useful:

 

- Sword - it's dangerous to go without one.

- Boomerang - being able to stun most enemies makes your adventure considerably easier.

- Magic shield - and suddenly those pesky WIzzobes and Lynels are not as threatening.

 

Rings and potions are useful when you have unfair battles (like the battle with Ganon, or a to a lesser extent a 4-headed Gleeok).


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#4 Lüt

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Posted 06 July 2017 - 04:01 PM

Sword and Boomerang are the obvious combo. I don't think I've ever seen anybody play this game who doesn't stun+slash every enemy they can.

 

Hammer is the best thing to make Darknuts tolerable, as is the Fire Boomerang to make Blue Wizzrobes and Peahats tolerable. They both do a wonderful job fixing those broken enemies.

 

Ring for sure, as much as armor is in any RPG. Every one essentially doubles your lifespan.

 

I also voted candle, as it can be a good barrier weapon, as well as deal multiple hits in quick succession to an enemy that doesn't get thrown backward from the attack.

 

Now I'm going to flip this and say that the shield is one of the most useless items in the game. I can understand how they thought it was realistic for Link to move the shield to the side when using weapons, or even catching the returning Boomerang. But the fact is, the downtime gap is long enough that, unless you stand there and refuse to attack while enemies approach you, it's only sheer fleeting luck that the shield may be in front of you to actually block an incoming attack. It's useless in combat over 90% of the time, and let's not even bring shooting statues into it. The only exception is a Mirror Shield against enemies whose attacks can be reflected to the extent that it damages them, making it yet another item that makes Blue Wizzrobes tolerable.

 

The Tiger Scrolls are also generally useless. They take time to charge, and your charge gets cancelled if you even get remotely touched by the slightest hazard - enemy, environmental, or whatever else is available. Not only that, even if you are charged, the attacks still get cancelled rather than unleashed at the slightest touch. And then when you're doing the attack, it can yet again get cancelled if so much as a molecule of air blows on you the wrong way. Hurricane spin is the worst of the bunch, giving you a grand attack that's cute in situations where it's not needed, yet unchargeable in situations where it is needed - and even if you do charge it, typically only by hiding in a dungeon doorway if that rule is enabled, the attack will either get cancelled when your sword tip touches something before you can use it, or you'll only get maybe 2 spins into it before a hit makes you drop the attack. Rarely have I ever seen such a good idea be such a waste.

 

So there's the best and the worst. The rest I rank in between depending on the scenario.



#5 Yloh

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Posted 06 July 2017 - 05:06 PM

I only voted for four enemies in the enemy topic and I will follow suit and only vote for four items here. Here are the items and the reasons why I voted for them.

 

Just like before, I'm going to assume these items have been unaltered as a quest designer can buff and nerf these items.

 

Sword

 

The more powerful the sword, the better! The master sword is crazy powerful. I put this item at number one because, if you can kill your enemies quickly, you won't have to worry about loosing HP. Sometimes the best defense is a good offense. If I had to choose between the master sword or gold ring, I would choose the master sword any day. Also, having the sword beam makes it so you can attack enemies at a safe distance. If you have the pearl beam scroll, this can help you stay alive while having very few hearts. Another thing, if the quest allows slash, you have a huge range on your attack. It is quite easy to attack enemies while keeping your distance with slash. 

 

Boomerang

 

Being able to stun most enemies is broken. I almost always have the boomerang equipped as my primary tool. If a quest designer offer's the fire boomerang in their quest, enemies have no hope. Darknuts can be a little tricky to stun sometimes, but the difficulty drastically goes down for just about every enemy possible. If the designer desires, you can have boomerangs pick up items for you. That is a great tool to get a life refill in risky places. The fire boomerang and nullify just about every dangerous enemy in Zelda Classic. 

 

Shield

 

In my enemy post, I said that not having the shield will automatically make any quest more difficult. No magic shield means you can't block flame 1, fireballs, sword, and magic attacks. Not having any shield makes it so you can't block anything else. I encourage you to try and play a quest without a shield. Even if you have a shield, I encourage you to try and dodge everything. If you hear your shield block something, consider that a hit. If you are someone who never uses their shield, I encourage you to try and use it. Sometimes it is better to focus on defense to help you survive the battle.

 

Arrows

 

Having a reliable distance weapon is so important in Zelda Classic. Sure, Darknuts, Wizzrobes, and most bosses are immune to arrows, but those are not the only enemies in Zelda Classic. Trust me, sometimes it is better to use your arrows vs your sword beam. When using your sword beam, it takes longer for Link to return to neutral position vs shooting an arrow. Neutral position is where Link can still use his shield to block attacks. The only real weakness of this item is that some quests only allow Link to use the standard arrows until the very end of the game. Still, that means early game Link has a white sword weapon while still having a wooden sword. If Link has the silver arrows in the middle of the game, you have a free (well with ammunition) quick magic sword beam attack at your disposal. Lets not forget the golden piercing arrows. That item is just stupid powerful. Just use that item to clear the room and use your fire boomerang to stun the Wizzrobes and Darknuts. 

 

Honorable Mentions

 

Bait

 

Yeah, that's right, I said the bait. I'm disappointed that it wasn't on the main list. This is probably the most underestimated item in Zelda Classic. This item is much more than a glorified key. It is the ultimate control tool. Let me explain. Lets say you are in a room full of Lynels and Darknuts. Use the bait and the Lynels will run towards the meat giving you space to clear the darknuts. After that, use your boomerang to stun the group of Lynels and take them out. How about a room with some Goriya 3s. Use your bait to put them in one group and kill them all at once. You will have less issues with their tracking boomerang attacks. Every standard overworld enemy can be controlled by the bait. Those scary Flame Octoroks can be controlled by the bait. I think you get my point. If you notice a lot of animal type enemies in a quest, use your bait to really control the battlefield.

 

Roc's Feather 

 

Next to the boomerang, I use this item more than every other. Just having the ability to move in areas enemies have no access to is invaluable. Why dodge or block when you can just jump over an enemy and attack from behind. It is stylish and useful. You are able to be put in situations where having a jumping mechanic (Not talking about sideview gravity levels) would turn an impossible battle into a possible battle. This item is made even better with the stomp boots. That just makes sure it is safe to land on most enemies. 

 

Candle

 

While most quests don't require it, I encourage you to watch my Liberation of Hyrule and Armageddon Quest videos. You will see why the candle is very powerful. It is a high skill item that can really save the day. Let me ask you, would you rather take 4 hearts of damage or 1/4 heart of damage? That is better than the rings. Use your flames to damage yourself instead of taking heavy damage from an enemy. Heck, you can even damage yourself to walk through damage combos. You might be able to break some quests this way. 

 

I can say something good about every item on this list, but these are the ones I voted for as the very best of them. 

 

In the end, it depends on how the quest designer designs their quest. Useful items in one quest can become useless in another quset. The top items on my list are items that can be useful in just about every quest situation. 



#6 pixcalibur

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Posted 06 July 2017 - 06:53 PM

I have a weird order of ranked items, but mostly consistent with those above.

 

 

Roc's Feather:  started to love this item from playing Randomizers.  Being able to freely move around in 8 directions, jumping and dodging, and shortcuts are just a few examples of this item's power.  Sometimes defensive maneuvers can create good offensive openings.  Combine this with Stomp Boots for defensive stomps or with Hover Boots for even more air time, which will prevent all kinds of pincer attacks.  Some of my LP's put the feather to good use in whittling down higher level Patras without breaking a sweat.

 

 

Sword:  basic attacks at first, but when you add the little ZC perks, the sword becomes a force that can do defense as well as offense.  Add slash in for great range that can snipe enemies.  Great for darknuts and wizzrobes.  Love Randomizer's so called "Spreader" sword, which shows off the true terror of a fully powered sword.

 

 

Boomerang:  not much until you hit fire boomerang level (magic in some quests), which then turns the boomerang from a regular accessory to a deadly tool that stuns about any enemy and damages weaker enemies.  Even the mighty Peahat falls victim to the fire boomerang's stun power

 

 

Candle:  took a while to figure this item out, but now I'm a fan of quests where the candle hurts you.  At 1/2 heart a hit with no armor, you can take that hit in exchange for damage boosting through anything ranging from red bubbles to the deadly deathknights and mirrorrobes.  Red candle almost becomes broken with this application in mind.



#7 Timelord

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Posted 06 July 2017 - 07:17 PM

Offensive Items
A Human will remove threats, not merely to merely protect against them. 
(Paraphrased, from Frank Herbert, 'Dune')
 
I will specifically note here, that I am not including any Sword item here. I find them to be overused, and that players have a sword-crutch syndrome. Quests that do not include a sword weapon--at all--are easily playable, and enjoyable; unless  the questmaker forgets to tune enemy defences to fit this change.
 
Bow and Arrow (Any)
I do love ranged attacks, and the base arrow is typically as powerful as the L2 sword. In fact, your arrows are often as powerful, if not more powerful than your present sword in most quests. I feel that the bow is a quite underused, an under-rated item
 
Magic Wand (no book)
I detest the Magic Book fire, as in most quests, it also hurts Link. I typically do not use the candle, for the same reason. If that quest rule is off, then both items become far more useful. If the wand costs MP, it drops off this list very quickly, unless the cost is tiny. Infinite weak projectiles are ideal for clearing rooms of weak enemies, or pushing foes away from you.
 
I use the bow and wand to eliminate LikeLike and similar enemies, that can grab Link, from a distance.
 
Roc's Feather
Easily the item in ZQuest that allow the player to most-abuse its capabilities. You can leap over enemies, water, and through doors. THis makes it extremely easy to run through screens filled with foes. Coupled with  the Stomp Boots, this can be used as a weapon.
 
Hookshot
Who does not love this item? Boing! Use it to stun nearly every enemy, including all Wizzrobe classes. It puts every category of boomerang to shame.
 
Boomerang
Before you have a hookshot, this is essential. Questmakers who assign an MP cost to this may as well not include it in a quest.
 
Hammer
This is primarily useful for Darknut shields. In quests that use splitting Darknuts, this is a very useful took. otherwise, it is a glorified key, although its hitbox size is rather large and it persists for a few frames, so it is possible to clobber a Patra with the hammer. Otherwise, it is too slow to be an enjoyable weapon.
 
Protective Items
Not critical to playing a quest, but helpful, are items that protect Link from harm.
 
Shield (Magic, or Mirror)
Deflecting nearly any projectile satisfies me. With the Mirror Shield, being able to deflect any projectile at all, at all, and reflect most others, is an added perk; and being inedible is a bonus. The shield also helps greatly in shooter rooms, to prevent Link from being tossed about like a pinball.
 
Ring (Armour)
Armour rings (any) are of course nice to have on hand. I do not object to questmakers who give these an MP cost, save that if you do this, you should make an equip/unequip function for them, so that simply owning one does not turn into an MP bleed event.
 
The Useless
I typically find all of the following, useless:
 
Heart/Magic Ring (Green)
The regen is so slow that by the time you notice that you have it, you find a full refill drop, or you are dead from the lack of one of these. You know, an arrow ring would probably be far better in this regard.
 
Cane of Byrna (Unscripted)
If given a magic cost, you may as well never use it. It wil bleed a full magic bar dry in seconds, as it eats its MP cost on a per-frame basis. Without a magic cost, unscripted, it is acceptable, but it does not do much unless you grant it five orbits.
 
Scrolls ( Most )
With the exception of Spin Attack, and spin-related scrolls, I have never seen a player use these when they are awarded. Typically, they grab them to 100% games. The spin scrolls are also nearly useless unless you also award the player a Charge Ring. Give out one of these beauties in Init Data, and a spin attack scroll in init data, and you will see a dramatic increase in the frequency of the player bothering to use a spin attack.

Edited by ZoriaRPG, 07 July 2017 - 07:41 AM.


#8 Anthus

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Posted 06 July 2017 - 09:39 PM

I picked quite a lot on this list. Some of these have probably been mentioned, or will be mentioned, but here goes:

 

Bomb

These things can potentially be really OP if you have a lot of them, and know the trick involving which direction Link is facing relative to the enemy. These are even more OP if they don't hurt Link. Bombs pose an interesting design dilemma in the world of ZC. You don't want players to have to hunt for them if they run out, but you presumably don't want players to just nuke everything in sight either. Making them scarce runs the risk of creating an annoying scenario where you have to go hunt bombs. I think to avoid this, bombs should have a cool down time like in ALBW/ BotW. This is doable in ZC, to an extent, with bomb bags that regenerate bombs.

 

Boomerang

Need I say more? If you've ever even seen a ZC quest, you'll know how borderline broken this thing's stun locking can be. I would like to save this for a late game weapon, personally, or nerf it so it can't stun virtually everything, and save that for its upgraded forms.

 

Candle

I personally love using the candle. If the fire hurts Link, it adds an extra little dynamic to it. You can do some serious crowd control with the red variant in close quarters, and it hurts. I usually use this a lot, even later in the game.

 

Din's Fire

Essentially an area nuke. Not much else to say. Good for taking out crowds of weak enemies, or making tougher foes back off a bit. Usually uses a ton of magic though, so depending on the quest, it might not always be the best option.

 

Hammer

It's as strong as the magic sword, and can break shields. Yeah, it's great. Arguably Link's most potentially OP weapon in its stock state.

 

Hookshot

This is just a ton of fun to use. Not to mention it gives you i-frames, and can stun anything a boomerang can.

 

Shield

Pretty self explanatory. Some tougher enemies, as I mentioned in the other thread, in particular, Blue Wizzrobes are nigh impossible without this in larger numbers.

 

Sword (Duh)

Unless you like relying on candle/ bomb/ wand strats, you gotta have a sword. :P

 

Wand + Book

(In Z1) Infinite ranged attack, and its powered up state leaves a fire? Sign me up. This is one of the coolest weapons in Z1, imo, and one I'm sure to include in my projects.



#9 Eddy

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Posted 07 July 2017 - 05:42 AM

Cane of Somaria (Unscripted)

If given a magic cost, you may as well never use it. It wil bleed a full magic bar dry in seconds, as it eats its MP cost on a per-frame basis. Without a magic cost, unscripted, it is acceptable, but it does not do much unless you grant it five orbits.

I believe you meant the Cane of Byrna. The Cane of Somaria is something entirely different :P

 

 

Anyways here are my picks, and like what has been said before, they kinda depend on the type of quest.

 

Sword - Probably one of the most useful items in ZC, since almost every quest ever uses at least one kind of sword. It's a pretty great offensive weapon and with slash enabled, it makes it even better.

 

Defence Rings - These are also great to have since more defence is always nice to get through the tough enemies later on in the quest. It's not a necessity, but it can be very useful to survive longer in harsher dungeons/environments. Gold Ring clearly is the best one (and most broken), but any would be great depending on where you are in the quest.

 

Shields - Specifically Magic and Mirror. The Magic shield is great for blocking almost all projectiles, and can really make fighting a lot easier since you won't have to worry about avoiding all the different projectiles coming towards you. The Mirror shield is great against killing Mirrorobes and could make cool usage for puzzles and stuff, however I do think it makes fighting enemies slightly harder when you're surrounded by statue shooters. Most of the time, you'll be reflecting fireball shots which are probably far weaker than your sword, so the reflected shots will be hitting enemies instead of your sword, taking longer to kill them. And so that becomes kind of an inconvenience at times.

 

Roc's Feather - A great item to break quests. I learnt that one the hard way :P Besides that though, it's a great item for avoiding hordes of enemies and can make fighting much more tolerable. In a way it kind of acts like a shield since you can just jump over all the projectiles, avoiding them with no problem. It's also great for getting from one place to another since you can just jump over everything and not worry about having to kill anything to progress onwards.

 

Lens of Truth - I'd consider this one very useful is you're the person who likes to go for 100%. In a standard Z1 quest, this would be incredibly useful to locate all the hidden secrets across the overworld without having to do the long tedious process of trial and error. It can also be nice and useful for non-Z1 quests for the similar reason and could make some cool dungeon puzzles.

 

Boomerang - Any kind of boomerang specifically. This thing is a beast and can be such a game breaker by stunning a wide variety of enemies, making them very easy to kill. The fire boomerang makes it even better by stunning almost everything as well as damaging enemies, making that item even more broken. Wizzrobes have become a joke with this item :P



#10 Cukeman

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Posted 07 July 2017 - 07:17 AM

In general I tend to think of items as belonging to different "classes" (there are usually exceptions with clever or unusual quest designs). Things like the sword, boomerang, blue ring and magic shield are infinitely useful by default (unless you are jinxed, or they are eaten). Things like the Amulet, Mirror Shield (and Wealth Medal) are only useful if you design your quest for them to be (are there invisible enemies and magic attacks? if yes, how many?). Arrows and other projectile weapons are very advantageous if the player has an adequate supply of them. Things like the Gold Ring, Heart Rings, Golden Arrows, and Magic Wallets are overpowered and game-breaking (I see them useful only as a fun novelty to mess around with once you've finished all or most of the game). Farore's Wind is basically ruined by F6 and it's easier to set up direct routes and warps than to make whistle warps helpful IMO. I don't like Ladders as they are clunky and often get in the way. Potions are awesome for dire situations and preventing long shopping trips (but I don't like enemies requiring potions for survival, especially multiple potions, just to stay alive long enough for you to damage them enough times).


Edited by Cukeman, 07 July 2017 - 07:19 AM.


#11 Timelord

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Posted 07 July 2017 - 07:43 AM

I believe you meant the Cane of Byrna. The Cane of Somaria is something entirely different :P

You are absolutely right mate. I blame this on staring at 'somaria_*' in code, for hours on end.


Edited by ZoriaRPG, 07 July 2017 - 07:44 AM.

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