Restarting whole thing
Posted 11 July 2018 - 03:41 PM
Posted 11 July 2018 - 10:11 PM
This is the core problem here. What you're saying is "I want a quest, but I don't make quests, so I'm gonna get somebody else to do it for me." Let me be blunt: That simply won't happen. Just look at the reaction every time you bring it up. Nobody wants to make somebody else's quest for them. You keep saying collaboration, but that's not at all what this is. You're asking somebody to just make a quest according to your vision. If you were paying them, then that'd be one thing, but we're a group of people doing hobbies in our spare time.
However since I am not really a quest maker and have a lot more things youtube and twitch wise to do, I am in talks with having someone else collaborate with me on this project.
I know you've heard this before. You hear this every time you make a thread about your project. And there's a reason why; it's because everybody is thinking the same thing. Again, let me blunt. This is self-entitled to an absurd degree. You're viewing yourself as so important that your vision simply should exist, and people should flock to you to make it for you. That's just not how it works. Nobody is going to make your quest for you. And you don't deserve for them to do so.
If you really, truly want this quest to exist, here are your options. 1) You've stated before that you're more of a story person and not so much of a design person. That kind of skillset lends itself best to mediums such as writing, rather than game-making. Why not tell your story in such a medium? Whether it be a novel, short story, audio drama, or what have you, there are several ways to get your story out. 2) You've stated that you're not really a quest maker. Become one. If you want to see your vision become reality, you have to put in the effort. You've played several quests as part of your LP channel. Learn how they work, what they did well and why it made the quest good. Learn the editor. Set aside time. Work on it. Heck, it doesn't even need to be a solo project; you could get friends to collaborate with you. But collaborate means two people both working on a quest. It does not mean one person telling the other to make a quest for them. And so long as you continue to expect people to line up to make your vision a reality because you're so important that it deserves to happen, the quest is going to continue being nothing more than an idea in your head and a wedge between you and the rest of the community
- Espilan, Anthus, Avataro and 7 others like this
Posted 12 July 2018 - 08:25 AM
Yeah, when making a quest you'll have to be prepared to put in the effort too.
But anyway, goodluck.
- Binx likes this
Posted 12 July 2018 - 12:36 PM
I'm sorry, but no one is going to make 11 quests for you, especially if you're not even willing to learn the program and help.
- Espilan, Aevin and Matthew like this
Posted 12 July 2018 - 12:59 PM
Posted 12 July 2018 - 02:20 PM
"The start of something incredibly new to me....making my own quest for the first time!" , maybe you must restart from this.
i'm sure you belived in it when you start, I hope you can regain that enthusiasm and try again
Posted 12 July 2018 - 04:56 PM
Avataro, Shoshon, and Dark Ice Dragon, thank you for the support. Rest of you, yall love to use the quote feature, well...
I am in talks with having someone else collaborate with me on this project
which means someone is willing to collaborate with me. Let me ask you, why do you make quests? Do you feel good about it being complete? If someone was asking for help, would you help them if it was their first time? I want to use ZC as a way to tell it because I love this community. I'll take your advice into consideration, but for now, my story with it keeps expanding.
Posted 12 July 2018 - 06:40 PM
Coming up with a story, however long or short it is, and basically telling someone else "hey, make this into a game for me" is not a collaboration.
Posted 12 July 2018 - 06:48 PM
"hey, make this into a game for me"
Right!....that's the idea that everyone is thinking....Wrong! Its called working together on it, not you do that and ill do that and sit in the background. I forgot thats what everyone keeps mistaking!
Posted 12 July 2018 - 06:54 PM
How do you envision responsibilities being divided between you and any other creator? In terms of work load and responsibilities in the various aspects of game design, what is it that you need from others vs. what you're able to handle yourself? I'd recommend you be clear and specific as to exactly what you want other people to do. How much of an input will they have on the formative aspects of the quest and its creative decisions? What do they get out of it?
If you want to collaborate with people, you have to entice them with stuff about the project that appeals to them. I'd try at least being a bit more specific with what it is you're looking for.
Posted 12 July 2018 - 07:03 PM
Map layout, i cant think of a decent map. Get out of it? Is this a pay thing now? All in all, a layout is it, thats where the trouble is if you want me to be specific. More and more, keep coming.
Posted 12 July 2018 - 07:09 PM
Nah, I don't mean pay. What would they get out of it emotionally? What about this project would satisfy them as a creator? Why wouldn't they just make something themselves? And what do you bring to the table that makes this project either easier or more fun than just doing their own thing? You gotta have a "pitch." If you want people to be excited to work with you, you've gotta generate that excitement, you know?
Posted 12 July 2018 - 07:14 PM
Look at Nightmare, that went well. I'd rather prove now since words arent getting through. Like i said, one creator is willing to team up and make one for me, 11 is long term goal but a stretch. I dont want to taint my rep on here than it probably already has. Plus, I more concerned why no one is wondering what happened to Atrus, he was willing.
Posted 12 July 2018 - 09:10 PM
If Atrus is having his personal life stuff going on, then he needs to deal with that first. This shows why quest creation shouldn't be fully delegated to another person. The project can end up going on hiatus for reasons outside your control. All of us have our personal lives and may not have the time to devote to a big project.
Ideally, it would be best for you to learn how to use ZQuest. That way, you will have ultimate control of what goes into the quest layouts, more so given you know how you want your quest to be like. You can better pace how progress goes along and what goes into it. And if more complicated concepts come up, you can ask in the forums, and I'm sure some people can suggest ideas or show you how to implement new concepts. Having someone else do the bulk of the quest creation can create conflict if the ideas don't match up, and you really won't be the main author of such a quest given you weren't the one who actually designed the quest.
Having a story in place is fine, but creating the quest layout itself is a different challenge. It takes time to come up with the final product, and even coming up with drafts can take a while. Try not to make it seem like you're in a rush to get the product out, as the results will speak for themselves. Brainstorm ideas, look at other good quests to get inspiration on designs that you can consider. Once you get the initial inspiration going and basic designs down solid, then the creativity can really start coming out.
Edited by pixcalibur, 13 July 2018 - 01:26 AM.
- Lüt likes this
Posted 12 July 2018 - 10:26 PM
Ambition is great and is what drives to making great quests, but what others have been saying is important as well. Relying on others to design layouts, which is a big task to do might I add, is risky as they might end up getting burnt out or get busy in their personal life. Quest makers enjoy making quests, sure, but a big part of it is having full creative control, or even half of it in terms of the bigger picture. Just because one person offered doesn't mean the idea of 11 collabs is suddenly more possible. There's still a great ton of risks that some have mentioned already. Heck, even designing a trilogy alone can be difficult and time consuming!
If you get someone to collab with you, great! I don't think anyone wants to destroy your vision, they're just trying to make you see other alternatives to get this vision across because 11 quests is a daunting task, it just is. It's rare to see people have that many quests and if they end up having that many, it takes years of patience and personal commitment. If you have that kind of time, you can learn the editor and learn how to build layouts yourself, so you can personally see your vision come true. Otherwise, you'll have to do your best to sell your story idea and give reasons as to why quest makers should give up their time to make maps for your story. I don't really see much about these 11 quests other than the names of them. And if we're being honest, it sounds like some of them can be merged into 1 singular quest.
For example, the first three quests seem to focus on Let's Players so it doesn't seem impossible to push it all into one nicely packed quest. Haunting Dreams and Awakening sound like they can be mixed in together, and the trials could be thrown in together in a similar manner. The last three being together could result in 11 quests being condensed down to 4 that still tell the whole story. It's not impossible to condense down a story idea to something more realistic. Of course, I don't know the scope of your story, and given there's 11 quests, I imagine there's a lot to be told... but you can always find what elements you can trim down, etc.
This isn't the biggest comparison but my quest had a bigger story planned, there was going to be a few more characters, areas and cutscenes, but given my limitations, I decided to trim down elements I could throw out and keep enough meat on the bone to present something realistic within my limitations. So it's not impossible to compromise your vision to see it through. You can always take what you cut out and implement the most of it in a sequel like what I plan to do.
It might sound like I'm rambling and throwing in what everyone said already, but it's because I think you don't quite understand how much it takes to design dungeons and layouts and I think it's clear given you don't seem to know the editor or quest making experience fully. Making a great, well written story isn't the easiest thing in the world, but it's easier than world building. Making maps and adding gameplay is usually the biggest factor in a quest. It's a big job, and you're probably only going to get close friends who might have some free time to help. Your idea of doing something that focuses on Let's Players honestly sounds a bit personal. What does a person who's never really watched a ZC let's play have to gain by making a quest about a group he doesn't know much about? Also recall you saying one quest had 40 dungeons in it? That's like, the size of 5 standard quests in one, really.
Your reputation isn't on the line, your vision is and people want to help in a way you probably didn't really intend. I hope you don't get upset and believe this is just a disconnection of the forums and let's players, because it's simply the belief there is one that's causing a disconnection. If you were to give what people say a chance, and not reject the community and believe there's a disconnect, then maybe we will get somewhere with your idea. In the meantime, whatever your decision is, I wish you good luck and know that no one means any ill intent.
- Anthus likes this
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