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Is this possible?


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#1 Bokoblin

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Posted 17 February 2023 - 11:34 PM

I am planning on updating the original Zelda game in a way that stays true to the feel of the game and Nintendo’s vision for the game. Modernizing it while still keeping the 8-bit graphics and the music.

 

One of the first ideas for this project that I had was new enemies. Not, say, recolored Moblins, but rather entirely new enemies with entirely new sprites, animations, and attacks. This would require an entirely new but relatively simple AI. For a melee enemy, it would just walk to a target tile, say, Link, and then attack. Every tile, it would change its sprite to make it look like a walk cycle.

 

My second idea is to modify existing enemies. The Stalfos is an enemy I am definitely planning on  revamping. Instead of just cannon fodder, my vision for these enemies is more akin to the modern Stalfos. Elite, rare skeletal knights that require a bomb to kill, and you can only bomb them once they are downed.

My third idea is a bit of an ambitious one. Revamp or replace entire areas. Instead of doo doo doo, doo doo doo doo doo doo doo, this is a forest full of Moblins, this is a forest full of Octoroks, forest, forest, forest, etc., it would be more like Breath of the Wild. This is a forest, and north of it is a graceful, unassuming pond. And then, a massive crab leg juts from the pond’s surface. A Gohma pops out of the water and attacks, and you have no bow to defend yourself. You run and run and run, and then you come across a camp full of Moblins. You slay the beasts, and claim their treasure for your own.

 

The main goal for this game that Shigeru Miyamoto had in mind was exploration, like how he would run off into the woods and explore as a child. But the limitations of the NES at the time were absolutely draconian, and the game barely achieved its goal. The overworld feels boring. Dull. Just a forest, and then a river, and then a mountain. No desert or volcano or rainforest. No camps full of monstrous life. No secret boss fights or lively towns. Just Octoroks and dungeons.

 

Breath of the Wild had all that, but there was no enemy variety to that game. The original Zelda was brimming with monsters, but they couldn’t be used in the way they should have due to the limitations of the NES. So, let’s fuse the two with the gift of modern technology.

 

I want to make a Zelda game. A good one. And I want to see if I can.

 

P.S. Is this even legal? Will I have an army of lawyers knocking on my door anytime soon because I want to update a game from the 1980s? Especially since I will be “importing” enemies from other Zelda games such as Bokoblins, Magtails, etc? I won’t be selling it to anyone, if anyone asks.


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#2 Aslion

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Posted 18 February 2023 - 01:28 AM

https://www.purezc.n...projects&id=542

https://www.purezc.n...projects&id=590


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#3 Naldrag

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Posted 18 February 2023 - 01:53 AM

I wouldn't worry about lawyers unless John McMahon decides to take the case.


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#4 TheRock

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Posted 18 February 2023 - 09:06 AM

https://www.purezc.n...e=quests&id=203



#5 Mitchfork

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Posted 18 February 2023 - 12:44 PM

Anything is possible, vaguely speaking. But a few things are difficult in ZC due to how the engine works.

Generally, when we consider "modifying" things (especially enemies), it's much more possible to start from scratch with coding new behavior than modifying existing behavior. While things have gotten better over time in this regard, I think this still holds mostly true. Anything where you want different behavior than default Zelda Classic enemies is going to take a fair bit of scripting.

So I guess when determining the scope of the project, I'd start with how comfortable you are with writing code? That's going to determine how far you can get from ZC's default mechanics.

Legality is what it is. But virtually (and maybe literally) every single completed project this community uses copyrighted graphics or music. We're small enough that we've never run into any problems, though.
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#6 Ether

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Posted 18 February 2023 - 02:26 PM

Hi! Yes, you can program your own monsters. This requires scripting. NPCScript will work for it; there's no tutorials for it but there is at least documentation at docs/ZScript_Additions.txt in your ZC folder. Ghost.zh is also an option; here's a tutorial for that. Some of the things you want, like enemies that chase you, might be wonky because ZC doesn't currently do screen scrolling. In theory that's being worked on, but I don't know the timetable. If you like the NES aesthetic but wish it were a little more ambitious, you might like the Cambria tileset.

 

As other people have noted, remaking Z1 is not a super original idea! Rebirth and Crucible Crest are both unfinished and Origin is kiiiiiiiiiiiiind of crusty and antiquated, but we've got more. There've been contests on the theme, even. I think Moosh's 7th Quest is probably the most Z1++ of them. Mitsu's I haven't played personally but I think she goes all in on crazy scripting and the quest screenshots should give you a good idea, Russ's is pretty story heavy and deviates pretty far from Z1 but it's an excellent quest in its own right and also has a very strong example of what you can do with chasing enemies. Mani Kanina's 6th Quest from a different contest also comes to mind, I know it's pretty original on items but it's another one I haven't played and don't know much about.

 

Making fangames using Nintendo's assets and characters is one of those things that they can teeeeeeeeechnically go after you for. Even fanart is a legal gray area. They don't generally bother unless it's being done for money or it picks up a ton of steam. Zelda Classic is a 20 year old program that's much less popular than it was in its heyday, and it was still pretty quiet even then. It has never caught Nintendo's ire before and I'd be pretty surprised if they took notice now. (On a related note, this is maybe not a good place to hope for a huge built in audience.)



#7 Bokoblin

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Posted 18 February 2023 - 02:30 PM

I am an utter beginner when it comes to coding, I have made a few Minecraft mods in the past, but that’s all. I figured since making ROM hacks/modded copies of NES games is easy, I’d continue my venture into game development with that.

 

The language that the original TLoZ is coded in is one of the easiest to learn, so maybe modifying enemies is possible, although ambitious, for a guy like me.

 

Thanks for showing me your quests, although I will take a different turn with mine. I will not upgrade the graphics at all, and any sprites I make will be in tune with the sprites of the OG game. This is a purposeful decision to make it feel like the vanilla game, with the same art style and music, just with a few additions.

 

THIS IS NOT A REMAKE. It’s just Vanilla+ Zelda. It’s more similar to a DLC or an update. Crucible Crest is an entirely new game with new graphics. TLOZ Expanded is more similar to the Quark mod for Minecraft.


Edited by TLOZExpanded_Dev, 18 February 2023 - 02:44 PM.


#8 Mitchfork

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Posted 18 February 2023 - 06:35 PM

Wait, so is this intended to be a rom hack, or ZC quest?

#9 Bokoblin

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Posted 18 February 2023 - 06:37 PM

ZC quest, since actual ROM hacks are illegal. Plenty of ROM hackers have been sued or thrown in jail, ZC is safer.


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#10 Russ

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Posted 18 February 2023 - 06:44 PM

The language that the original TLoZ is coded in is one of the easiest to learn, so maybe modifying enemies is possible, although ambitious, for a guy like me.

It's worth noting that ZC script is not the language Zelda 1 was coded in. ZC was built from the ground up to very closely copy Z1, but it's a completely different codebase. The scripting language it uses is based off C. It's not very difficult to do simple things in it, but there are certainly rabbit holes you can fall down as you improve.
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#11 Naldrag

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Posted 18 February 2023 - 06:51 PM

People have been sued for hosting ROMs and fan games have had cease and desists but no one has been sent to jail for doing ROM hacks of Zelda 1.  In general most ROM hacks don't even get cease and desists since they're almost always presented as patches and not full on ROMs.

 

ZC quest, since actual ROM hacks are illegal. Plenty of ROM hackers have been sued or thrown in jail, ZC is safer.



#12 Bokoblin

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Posted 18 February 2023 - 07:13 PM

It’s intended to be an unofficial update with new enemies and improvements to the open world. This update will follow the same style and feel of the vanilla game.



#13 Mitchfork

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Posted 18 February 2023 - 08:06 PM

It is no longer possible, I'm sorry.
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#14 Emily

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Posted 19 February 2023 - 02:41 AM

I am an utter beginner when it comes to coding, I have made a few Minecraft mods in the past, but that’s all. I figured since making ROM hacks/modded copies of NES games is easy, I’d continue my venture into game development with that.

 

The language that the original TLoZ is coded in is one of the easiest to learn, so maybe modifying enemies is possible, although ambitious, for a guy like me.

 

Thanks for showing me your quests, although I will take a different turn with mine. I will not upgrade the graphics at all, and any sprites I make will be in tune with the sprites of the OG game. This is a purposeful decision to make it feel like the vanilla game, with the same art style and music, just with a few additions.

 

THIS IS NOT A REMAKE. It’s just Vanilla+ Zelda. It’s more similar to a DLC or an update. Crucible Crest is an entirely new game with new graphics. TLOZ Expanded is more similar to the Quark mod for Minecraft.

ZC is not a modded zelda, it is completely built from the ground up in C++. The scripting language you use to customize things in quests is called ZScript, a language designed specifically for this program.

 

This is NOTHING like a romhack.


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#15 Naldrag

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Posted 27 February 2023 - 02:07 AM

It is no longer possible, I'm sorry.

It is perhaps possible now.


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