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Block puzzles in correlation to shutter doors


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#1 ChrisHunter64

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Posted 23 November 2019 - 09:36 PM

So as the title suggests ive been having trouble with a particular issue revolving shutter doors. My puzzle is one of those push a block onto a designated block trigger flag puzzles. Ive gotten it to work opening the doors using secret flags 16 and 17 on the shutter door and it works on the screen it happens on however when i walk through to test it and come back in the room the shutter doors are closed again and i cant get through essentially locking myself in. Ive set the room to be interior and ive tried making the room i go into as an interior room aswell however it doesnt work. Ive run out of ways to fix it as far as i can tell but i know theres a way to do it cause ive seen other quests do it aswell. Any help is greatly appreciated. I know ive been posting alot of problems on here as of late but its simply because i keep running into issues that seem to be above my head. Im using zquest 2.53

#2 Emily

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Posted 23 November 2019 - 09:50 PM

So as the title suggests ive been having trouble with a particular issue revolving shutter doors. My puzzle is one of those push a block onto a designated block trigger flag puzzles. Ive gotten it to work opening the doors using secret flags 16 and 17 on the shutter door and it works on the screen it happens on however when i walk through to test it and come back in the room the shutter doors are closed again and i cant get through essentially locking myself in. Ive set the room to be interior and ive tried making the room i go into as an interior room aswell however it doesnt work. Ive run out of ways to fix it as far as i can tell but i know theres a way to do it cause ive seen other quests do it aswell. Any help is greatly appreciated. I know ive been posting alot of problems on here as of late but its simply because i keep running into issues that seem to be above my head. Im using zquest 2.53


You cannot use interior screens with NES dungeon doors. You cannot use permanent secrets with NES dungeon screens. So, you need to figure something else out.
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#3 NoeL

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Posted 23 November 2019 - 10:00 PM

Do you want the doors to close again after you've walked through? If not, just make the secrets permanent (probably a good idea from a gameplay perspective too - no one wants to redo tedious block puzzles).

If you do... I'm thinking an elaborate setup involving step->next combos and tiered secrets... or if you know a specific quest where you've seen it done you could ask the creator. There may be a more elegant scripted solution.
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#4 ChrisHunter64

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Posted 24 November 2019 - 12:31 AM

You cannot use interior screens with NES dungeon doors. You cannot use permanent secrets with NES dungeon screens. So, you need to figure something else out.

 

 im not using shutter doors im using the solid shutter tile and making it change to the open tiles using secret combos. and ive already selected the hit all triggers -> perm secrets  and 16-31 on the screen settings. it works on the screen that the puzzle is on, do the puzzle and door opens, but when you walk back the door (tile) is back to the shutter tile. id have to track down those quests again it was awhile ago that i seen. there was a quest where you had to push the block into a shape and it opened the door so im assuming i should be able to do it without scripts. it should work in theory since puzzles can be set as permanent but maybe block puzzles always reset... i think i just answered my question.


im pretty sure i can find a way to get around this by placing a warp in the room it leads too and locking the door behind you as you enter as a sort of halfway point. acutally makes the level cause it makes a shortcut which i was struggling to find a way to fit one into my level. again i do appreciate the input. any information i get on this site to help me hone my zquest skill go a long way. i hope to someday not even ask for help.



#5 ChrisHunter64

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Posted 24 November 2019 - 12:52 AM

nvm wouldnt be a shortcut anyways since you would teleport to a locked room lol fml


Edited by ChrisHunter64, 24 November 2019 - 12:52 AM.


#6 NoeL

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Posted 24 November 2019 - 02:46 AM

Hmm, weird the permanent secrets aren't staying permanent. Don't have temporary secrets checked in the screen data or anything do you? The dmap data might have something like that too, I can't quite remember and can't check right now.
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#7 Lüt

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Posted 24 November 2019 - 05:31 AM

I think block secrets are always temporary regardless of NES/interior/overworld map types.

That's probably why the Permanent Block Secrets script exists, and the quests you've seen it in probably used that script, or something similar.
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#8 ChrisHunter64

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Posted 24 November 2019 - 11:32 AM

I see. I figured that might be the case after realizing that. I just ended up putting a teleport pad that sends you to the beginning. It doesnt really hurt the flow of the dungeon and it might be a cool trope to put in other dungeons to make it look like it was done on purpose lol.

#9 Jamian

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Posted 24 November 2019 - 12:45 PM

The best solution for this is probably to use the permanent block secrets script. Block secrets are never permanent unless you use such a script.


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#10 NoeL

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Posted 24 November 2019 - 04:18 PM

The devs really should do something about that. I guess it makes sense since the blocks always reset themselves, but tedious block puzzles are a ZC staple so there should be an option to make them permanent.

Alternatively (and I would prefer this a thousand times over) people should stop putting tedious block puzzles in their fucking quests!!! Even having to do them once is rarely fun. If you're going to have them, use them sparingly and for the liyve of God make them SHORT.

#11 Geoffrey

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Posted 24 November 2019 - 10:16 PM

Hey dumbos it's geoffrey here ready to blow ur mindz

 

Put the top two combos of the door on layer 3 or 4. Then put two step triggers underneath on layer 0. When Link walks back into the room, he'll immediately trigger the secrets, the door will open, and it will function as if it were a proper NES shutter. No scripts needed.

 

Or use the script. It's up to you. You kids have it sooooo easy these days.


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#12 Emily

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Posted 25 November 2019 - 06:01 AM

The devs really should do something about that. I guess it makes sense since the blocks always reset themselves, but tedious block puzzles are a ZC staple so there should be an option to make them permanent.

So, you'd like us to make ZC permanently remember the location of blocks? Yeah, not happening.
Secrets are a BOOL. They are either triggered or not. To remember exact positions of every block is beyond what ZC will do in-engine.
SCRIPTS on the other hand, CAN handle this if you want. The engine never will, though.

#13 P-Tux7

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Posted 25 November 2019 - 01:16 PM

So, you'd like us to make ZC permanently remember the location of blocks? Yeah, not happening.Secrets are a BOOL. They are either triggered or not. To remember exact positions of every block is beyond what ZC will do in-engine.SCRIPTS on the other hand, CAN handle this if you want. The engine never will, though.


NoeL probably means that block puzzle secrets should always be permanent. But people often use block puzzles in DMap types that do not have permanent secrets, or don't check the screen secrets as permanent or something.

#14 Jamian

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Posted 25 November 2019 - 01:51 PM

Block secrets are never permanent, regardless of dmap type or screen flags.



#15 Geoffrey

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Posted 25 November 2019 - 02:47 PM

Why exactly can't secrets triggered by block puzzles be made permanent? It seems bizarre that this one type of secret should be different from all others.




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