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What will happen after 2.5 (and currently)


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#31 Freedom

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Posted 24 April 2010 - 01:52 PM

Fixing a bug in zelda classic isn't for me, it's for zelda classic

The "magical" crashes aren't only happening to me, but if you believe that, then why not call it bug free and call for it to be released as stable, then we'll see how it holds up.
Remember to put your name on it.
Maybe that release will generate enough interest to get others looking at it again and you can explain to them that the crashes are because of their system too, and Zelda Classic itself is bug free.
;O)


#32 Plissken

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Posted 24 April 2010 - 02:03 PM

When did I say you need to fix bugs? That one entering tiles crash seems to be only happening to you, unless there's some place else people are discussing that issue.

Remember how 2.10 was when it was released? It had bugs, but it still "held up" (and for a lot of big bugs still present, they went back and fixed them for 2.10.1 and 2.10.2 and everyone seemed cool with it.) And I'm fine with calling for a release right now because, as I've said before, I work with the program every single day and have yet to have a crash for quite awhile. I think a release would be fine right now.

EDIT: Also, I'm not calling ZC bug free. I'm simply saying this (hopefully you'll learn to read this statement carefully to actually understand what I'm saying. I'll even put it in Dick and Jane sentences for you. ;O) ): "You report bugs, that's good. You constantly criticize devs while they try to help. That is counterproductive (bad). I try to hunt down any critical bugs that come up. Sometimes I can confirm they are there. I have tried for quite awhile to hunt down enter tiles crashing bug. I can't find a reason, or replicate it. Apparently, no one but you can. I report minor bugs I find, because that's all I ever find. Minor bugs. ALL software released EVER has minor bugs. Zelda Classic is not bug free."

There, is that easy enough to finally understand what I've been saying?

Edited by Plissken, 24 April 2010 - 02:20 PM.


#33 Freedom

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Posted 24 April 2010 - 02:35 PM

let me put this in a dick and jane sentence for you as well then ;O)

A bug that the devs fix in ZC is not a bug fixed for me, it is a bug fixed for the betterment of the ZC program.
They are NOT my bugs
I did NOT cause them.
I simply reported them.
IF they are fixed, it is NOT for ME that they are fixed.

"There, is that easy enough to finally understand what I've been saying?"


That said, you're starting to sound like a smart ass, which is what got me and Jman started which resulted in all of this
We can meet in person if you prefer, I think you'll be more cordial if we do.

That being said, the bug with crashing is real, regardless of yours or Jmans belief that it is real, and I'm just as happy sitting back waiting for it to catch up with others, as it surely will.
I hope the devs are more willing to work with them then.

#34 elise

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Posted 24 April 2010 - 03:07 PM

You know when you are asked to do something and you do it ,its always nice as they just let you know that they received it or saw it so you don't feel ignored .
I reported some logfiles and felt very ignored I stopped doing it icon_rolleyes.gif

#35 ShadowTiger

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Posted 24 April 2010 - 05:45 PM

Ick. When I read that elise, I immediately thought of a library. You donate books to a library so that other people can read them and enjoy them and make use of them, but we never really get any notifications that people are reading or enjoying or making use of them. Donating them to the library is better than burning them, after all.

But that's just a lateral motion of the analogy that has been going around in this post and the last. It's just an analogy, using words and imagery and theory. It's not that practical to what Bug-Reporting represents.



On to the matter at hand; I too have experienced no crashes in the past two months. I've been using ZQuest religiously to create a 2D animation project for school. It makes heavy use of Freeform Combos and scripts, and many combos are involved.

#36 elise

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Posted 24 April 2010 - 06:47 PM

you see ICK I see normal polite morals and ethics ,. a simple I got it would have been enough


#37 Plissken

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Posted 24 April 2010 - 07:26 PM

QUOTE(Freedom @ Apr 24 2010, 03:35 PM) View Post

A bug that the devs fix in ZC is not a bug fixed for me, it is a bug fixed for the betterment of the ZC program.
They are NOT my bugs
I did NOT cause them.
I simply reported them.
IF they are fixed, it is NOT for ME that they are fixed.

"There, is that easy enough to finally understand what I've been saying?"


That being said, the bug with crashing is real, regardless of yours or Jmans belief that it is real, and I'm just as happy sitting back waiting for it to catch up with others, as it surely will.


I never said it wasn't real, now you're just putting words in my mouth. I'm saying that stop complaining about not receiving help when you are currently being helped. I said that no one else is able to recreate it, not saying it isn't real. I program in C++, Java, and Python I know how bugs work and I know you didn't create it. BUT, with that being said, if no one else has found it, been able to recreate it, or whatever it just seems very very very situational and a very specific string of events to cause it. That type of bug is nearly impossible for a dev to find, so don't expect them to be able to fix all the problems because a program is NEVER bug free (at least, programs the size of ZC). Now with that being said, I don't think we should ignore the problems. I'm just saying to stop having such a negative attitude toward the subject. It is only counter productive and ends up causing more splits in the community as a whole.

QUOTE

I hope the devs are more willing to work with them then.


Willing to work with them THEN? They are helping you right now. So what if he took a bit to respond? Do you always expect snappy service on something that's FREE? He didn't even request it from you (like you said he did) you just sent it off. While that doesn't mean he shouldn't look at it, don't get on is case when he does. Doing someone a free service gets a lot less enjoyable when ALL they do is complain about it.

QUOTE

That said, you're starting to sound like a smart ass, which is what got me and Jman started which resulted in all of this
We can meet in person if you prefer, I think you'll be more cordial if we do


I call people out online and in real life as well, the whole "real life" idiotic threat never puts a dent in anyone's side, I'm kinda amused to see you even pull that old as dirt card.

QUOTE(elise @ Apr 24 2010, 04:07 PM) View Post
You know when you are asked to do something and you do it ,its always nice as they just let you know that they received it or saw it so you don't feel ignored .
I reported some logfiles and felt very ignored I stopped doing it icon_rolleyes.gif


Whenever I report I get quick answers and fixes. Now, I don't report nearly as often (mainly cause when I'm about to go report something, it's already been reported) but when I do I never have a problem with the process. And even if I didn't get a quick response, but rather it took awhile for a response, hey at least I got a response.

Edited by Plissken, 24 April 2010 - 08:08 PM.


#38 ShadowTiger

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Posted 24 April 2010 - 07:41 PM

QUOTE(elise @ Apr 24 2010, 07:47 PM) View Post

you see ICK I see normal polite morals and ethics ,. a simple I got it would have been enough


Oh, no, it's not that... I do apologize for the misconception caused by my poor choice of words. My mind tends to wander at times, and often wanders into corners of philosophy few dare go, much less wish to go. (That includes poor choices of words, such as "Ick") and in this case, the ick in question was simply the fact that we've wandered into a story of semantics and analogies at all. I am absolutely positive that both of our intentions were of politeness and manners, and I thank you for that. It is too rare in this world. Of course, how they actually end up on our plate in the end is a different matter entirely, and I can guarantee you that your methods surpass mine tenfold to date. You're the best, elise. <3


QUOTE
Whenever I report I get quick answers and fixes. Now, I don't report nearly as often (mainly cause when I'm about to go report something, it's already been reported) but when I do I never have a problem with the process. And even if I didn't get a quick response, but rather it took awhile for a response, hey at least I got a response.
Fixing the bugs is more important than replying to the bugs with any response at all. Sometimes there is no need for a post by a Dev to request an elaboration. Occasionally you'll find a situation where there will be an entry on Shardstorm but not in its matching bug report that it's been fixed.

It would be nice if there was perfect communication between the two, but it's not automated in the least, and is sometimes a bit more work than is necessary to hunt down the matching thread and say "closed" .. because eventually people go through the bug reports and see what is and what is no longer a bug, and comment on it if they so choose, if it was a noteworthy one in their mind.

#39 Freedom

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Posted 24 April 2010 - 08:12 PM

QUOTE
Willing to work with them THEN? They are helping you right now. So what if he took a bit to respond? Do you always expect snappy service on something that's FREE? He didn't even request it from you (like you said he did) you just sent it off. While that doesn't mean he shouldn't look at it, don't get on is case when he does. Doing someone a free service gets a lot less enjoyable when ALL they do is complain about it.


He posted a thread asking for people to send user dumps
he then ask me in a thread if this crash was still happening when we were discussing another bug, that time it was L that insisted it wasn't a bug, and in Jman's defence he corrected him I believe.
I told him the next time it crashed I would send him the user dump

to me, that is him requesting it

Offering to meet in public is no hollow threat, if you want to talk down your nose at me like you began to do above, with your dick and jane bull****, then give me an address and I'll ride on up and we'll talk.
You obviously aren't doing any better at reading my posts, as much of what you responded with wasn't even a true response to what I said.

Civility goes both ways, and you threw the first mud, I started out being civil and even using smiley faces, you started out being a smart ass.

#40 Plissken

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Posted 24 April 2010 - 08:15 PM

QUOTE(Freedom @ Apr 24 2010, 08:12 PM) View Post

Civility goes both ways, and you threw the first mud, I started out being civil and even using smiley faces, you started out being a smart ass.


So I guess you constantly trying to stir up trouble with your under the cuff insults to the devs is me throwing the first mud?

QUOTE(Freedom @ Apr 24 2010, 08:12 PM) View Post

You obviously aren't doing any better at reading my posts, as much of what you responded with wasn't even a true response to what I said.


How? What constitutes "a true response to what I said." A response that is truthful in it's meaning? Or a response that stays true to the issue at hand?

Edited by Plissken, 24 April 2010 - 08:18 PM.


#41 Freedom

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Posted 24 April 2010 - 08:25 PM

You threw the first mud at me.
What I say to a developer is between me and them, they're grown up and can speak for themselves, Jman had no trouble stating his point of view on AGN.

A true response is one that reflects on the comment it is responding to

You went on about how I wasn't able to read and understand your post while completely misinterpreting the post you were quoting
Isn't that what we call the pot calling the kettle black?

I used your same exact quotes back at you.

#42 Plissken

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Posted 24 April 2010 - 08:29 PM

Let's see that first time I quoted you I simply asked for clarification (which I didn't receive until after a few more posts (so I did kinda assume an answer before than)).

Then I was quoting this:
QUOTE
Fixing a bug in zelda classic isn't for me, it's for zelda classic


By saying "When did I say you need to fix bugs?", because you just implied that I implied that you yourself should be fixing bugs? At least... I think, I admit I was kinda confused as per the meaning of that sentence.

Edit: And as for the whole mud thing. I dunno, you just seem to talk around as if you're untouchable and no one would dare ever try to contradict Freedom's opinion. I simply find it ridiculous how often you seem you think you need to complain and cause little fits in the community and the devs about 2.5's development.

Edited by Plissken, 24 April 2010 - 08:33 PM.


#43 Freedom

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Posted 24 April 2010 - 08:36 PM

There really isn't much point to all of this is there?

This is a thread about what people want to see in a future release that they expect to see once 2.5 is released.

Pretty much the same thing that was going on 6 years ago when beta suggestions were closed to work towards a new release that has still never come, and really still doesn't look to promising even at this point.

There were a lot of beta testers back then, and one by one they have all given up and moved on.

Nothing has changed, and it doesn't look likely that it will any time soon.

#44 Plissken

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Posted 24 April 2010 - 08:37 PM

Well...yeah I guess you could say this topic has kinda gone off on a tangent...

#45 Gleeok

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Posted 25 April 2010 - 12:51 AM

Freedom, would you stop picking fights in random topics and turning everything into a zc suxorz it will crsah your computer and kill your dog debate. They all end up like a bad episode of South Park where nobody learns a lesson at the end. Last I heard you just released a full length 2.5 quest in a recent beta. A hundred or so builds ago I made a Tetris clone with zc, and in build 1004 I released an Arena Shooter 'SSS'...which all seem pretty bug free if you play them in the correct build.

..Now I'm not saying that there are no bugs left, but I am saying that it's not a critical mass explosion imminent scenario like you make it out to be.






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