39 replies to this topic

[nandobyker]

Also there is a way to use a ps3 controller on bluetooth

 

with an aplication called  sixaxis on android

 

and you can add 2  bluetooth controller suport , but i see that pointless

 

 

 

if only it were that simple. I would load up windows or Linux on my phone and play some quests. ZC only supports desktop operating systems. That's the simple answer.

 

there is  a way to install an operating sistem like windows xp , with an aplication called bochs and qemu but it it runs slow like the zelda classic on dosbox

[SUCCESSOR]

Also there is a way to use a ps3 controller on bluetooth

with an aplication called sixaxis on android

and you can add 2 bluetooth controller suport , but i see that pointless




there is a way to install an operating sistem like windows xp , with an aplication called bochs and qemu but it it runs slow like the zelda classic on dosbox

Yes, there are plenty of ways play on a phone besides the touch screen. I use a Wii remote and classic controller occasionally.

Yes, it would be slow. Your phone would be emulating a desktop operating system. DOS would be a better way to go. If you have a decent phone running ZC through dosbox should not be slow. If ZC 1.9 can run through dosbox on a Wii at good speed, then I think a current or last gen phone can run 2.5 the same way at a decent speed.

Edited by SUCCESSOR, 23 February 2014 - 04:54 PM.

[trudatman]

1.90 on DOSbox on Wii is mostly a myth.  you'd need a quest that doesn't do any of several certain things that would lead to crashes and it still isn't great, assuming you can even get it working at all.  1.90 and DOSbox aren't really compatible with each other in the first place.

[SUCCESSOR]

1.90 on DOSbox on Wii is mostly a myth.  you'd need a quest that doesn't do any of several certain things that would lead to crashes and it still isn't great, assuming you can even get it working at all.  1.90 and DOSbox aren't really compatible with each other in the first place.

I am not aware of the issues you mention. I've seen it work. It held a fairly decent review on Homebrew Channel, someone was pleased.

[nandobyker]

if anyone know whats the best settings to config on dosbox on android please tell me i want to know

 

i really try almost all cpu type and other stuff on the settings , and it still unplayable

 

i did try zelda classic 1.0  (the oldest vertion) on dosbox it runs almost playable but still choppy sound and you cant play any new quest on there

[SUCCESSOR]

I tried aDosBox to run 2.10 but none of the settings i tried would give me a decent speed. I switched to DosBox Turbo and after a
working a few kinks with settings I got a quest loaded and running at a playable speed. only Link kept moving down and left and I couldn't get it to stop. not sure what's happening there.

[cosmofield]

i with it was playable on Android as well, i use a Chromebook nowfortimes, i miss ZC -_-

 

recently, since i'm rather savvy in JavaScipt and HTML5, i thought "how much effort would be required to make a Z1-clone playable inside a browser?" it just stayed as a crazy idea, althought i think its feasible =w=

[MoscowModder]

I use the program Construct 2 that makes HTML5/JS games. You could feasibly make a Z1 clone in that, but good luck re-creating ZC in that (read: you pretty much can't).

[anikom15]

Why not? JavaScript is more than capable of handling something like ZC. The only question is performance, for which HTML5 seems awful, but in an ideal browser it should be totally doable.

[Timelord]

From a strictly technical perspective, I would be curious what functions of the Android APIs and kernel would not be supported by ZC. Android, is from what I recall, fully POSIX compliant, and given that we have Mac and Linux binaries, I'm mostly interested in what components are not viable. Isn't gcc available for Android now?

I would not however, personally be all that interested in a port to Android: It would be far too awkward to try to play a game, unless the UX API is fully integrated, allowing a touch-based game. Something like the 'Engage to Zeldawok', style mouse controls would work best in that kind of situation, but you would also need to control player movement, and buttons. It would be very limiting on the majority of consumer devices available today... The Android UX is far too reliant on the touchscreen environment, and I have yet to see a mainstream mobile device that is valid for D-Pad style gaming (although I did design one, similar to the Pandora, except seven years earlier).

 

On that subject, if you really want ZC on the go, the Pandora 1Ghz (or something similar) is probably what you want. I would think that it would be rather simply to run ZC to that; for it should run as-is, with no porting required. You may need to put together a custom Linux build, to satisfy all the dependencies, although I highly suspect that boot images exist that cover all of the needs of PZC. I don;t know how well it will run, if you try heavily-scripted games, or if it will suffer from the kind of slowdown that ZC had on Ubuntu builds on my netbook. (I was never able to actually use ZC 2.50 on Linux without a very fast system, as ZC seemingly isn't all that optimised on Linux, unlike the Windows version)

You can probably find a Pandora 1Ghz for around £350/$500 (half that price for the original, 500MHz model). I do not know if ZC will run without modifications on the Pandora, nor if it would run well on it, but it is probably the best option for a portable game system that you can find, given that you can run dozens of emulators, and full programmes. I know they can run Debian, but you may need to build a dependency tree on your own.
 
A really nice feature, is that the Pandora runs its OS from an SD card, so you can have a library of **both** OSes, and programmes, on SD cards, that you can swap, like game cartridges. THis may be slower than directly controlled NAND, but it makes it very easy to handle multiple OS builds, for whatever you want to do. It also has A/V out, so you can connect it to a television, plus 802.11g, so you can use it as a full web-device, so all-around, it's pretty cool, and realises something that I envisioned in 2001. (Nobody would even consider manufacturing a device like that at the time, and my design was a bit larger, with a 6" screen.)
 
It does have 512MB of NAND too, for whatever reason, and has a microphone input (built-in, or external), plus sound output (internal speakers, and a phono jack), so you can also use it as a phone, using VoIP, in any WiFi area: It is pretty much as cool as can be, and I honestly don't know why I haven't bought one, aside from the fact that i am rarely out anywhere, unless it is for work reasons, so I don't honestly need such a device, but I would get a great deal more use out of it, than I do my 3DS. The steep price, is probably the only real reason that i don;t have one at my side, but considering the cost of mobile devices, it isn't much higher than the cost of my phone.
 
If it was also GSM, I wouldn't even hesitate for one second to buy one.
 
Here is the spec sheet, for those who are curious, and have never even heard of the Pandora.
 
On another front, in the next few years, the CPUs and RAM in most mobile devices will have doubled, or quadrupled in relative performance, so emulation will be possible, given time. Until then, you might want to keep your eyes both on Tizen, and on Ubuntu Touch. I don;t see either driving out the Android market, simply because the Android branding is so fully-etched into the minds of consumers, who couldn't care less about what OS they are running, versus how many 'apps' they can download.  (When did humans start calling any programme an 'app'?)
 
NTT Domoco is supposedly releasing a Tizen-based device soon, unless thay have done so, and I didn't notice. Another big problem for Tizen, is that it is entirely open-source, and mobile service providers do not want that! They have historically, done everything possible to maintain control over what people can do with devices. As a grand example, the Palm Treo 700p was capable of WiFi, and Palm developed both a WiFi card, and drivers for PalmOS; but due to their contracts with Sprint and Verizon, they never produced a device with these enabled. It was possible to hack a 700p or 755 (and possibly a 650) to use the drivers--they were on the 700p, in ROM--and run it on WiFi, but you could not switch between WiFi mode, and CDMA/TDMA/GSM without manually changing the driver in use.
 
Why? Simply, because mobile providers did not want people using their devices for VoIP of any sort. The big enforcement policy now, streaming bandwidth, is an essential control element. The providers do not want customers who have 'unlimited data' contracts, to be able to tether their devices, and maintain their 'unlimited bandwidth' on the newest network speeds, that easily rival low-end cable connections. ROM images that come with mobiles, do two things to prevent this, in most cases:
 
(1) Report when the phone is tethered, so that the MSP can enforce a tethering cap, and overage charges.
(2) Report what browsers, or programmes are calling for WAN data, for the same reason.
 
At present, you can overcome both, by being clever. If you rootkit a mobile, you can run alternative data repeating software,that uses a standard data connection (not capped), and repeat it via the WiFi hardware to another device, such as a laptop.
 
Run hacks on your desktop/laptop software, to make them report a false programme name, and version number.
 
In an open-source OS, it would be possible to modify the ROM image to the extent that it cannot report either condition, at a very low level. That is the last thing that MSPs desire...

[nandobyker]

hello ZoriaRPG thanks for your comments and opinions, the only thing i dont like of the openpandora devide is that is not a phone , is just only a micro computer with wifi, i would buy it if it have phone suport.
i think is posible to run linux on android i saw it on google , maybe is posible to play zelda classic on there i wonder if it work

[Timelord]

You could run a small distro, butmost mobile devices simply haven't the space to run a full disro, with all the dependencies that you would need. Further, it would be horribly slow, and verydifficult to control, if it works at al.

I agreee that the Pandora would be cooler if it had a SIM card socket. I expect that the lack on phone company support is the primary reason that it doesn't. Really, it is meant as a po,cket computer and game console, and there is no mobile phone that is designed for that.

If you were able to run ZC on a phone, you could probably use ZQ to work on your quests on the go, but playing a game in ZC would be a nightmare. I'm not even certain how well the Pandora would handle running ZC, for as I had mentioned, my Atom-based netbook, at nearly twice the power of the Pandora, runs games in ZC at about 60% of normal speed in Linux (Ubuntu 10.04 LTE, 3.2.6 kernel, Gnome).

[nandobyker]

i was able tu run zelda classic v2.10 dos with an aplicattion called dosbox turbo and i configured all the things , and the best i did, the game runs  frameskip 18/60  it can be played but it still slow, on the computer it run 60/60.

 

i saw on the net that is posible to play 90's to 1999 windows games installing windows 98 operating system with dosbox turbo aplication and some games are heavier than zelda classic i guess, i dont understand why zelda classic is so dificult to run because it dont have much graphics like other 90's to 1999 windows games

[Timelord]

i was able tu run zelda classic v2.10 dos with an aplicattion called dosbox turbo and i configured all the things , and the best i did, the game runs  frameskip 18/60  it can be played but it still slow, on the computer it run 60/60.

 

i saw on the net that is posible to play 90's to 1999 windows games installing windows 98 operating system with dosbox turbo aplication and some games are heavier than zelda classic i guess, i dont understand why zelda classic is so dificult to run because it dont have much graphics like other 90's to 1999 windows games

 

I'm not one of the developers, so I can;t give you in-depth, technical details. From what I understand, the Allegro (Atari Low-LEvel Game ROutines)  libraries (v4, for ZC, IIRC) are the primary problem, and they are a prime dependency for ZC, as it stands today. I don;t know if ZC was ever shifted to Allegro 5,, and Allegro is rather CPU heavy in some aspects, and unfortunately, ZC still has many flaws that make both it, and the Allegro.cc libraries un-optimised. As to the Allegro name, I'm going. to flag that as a 'LISA: Let's Invent Some Acronym'.

 

Allegro is an additional HAL, running above, and not in direct cooperation with the OS API, which is what makes code so portable. It is less independent than a JAVA RTE, but it is still an interpreter, so it will take CPU cycles, to translate code from the programme->Allegro->local API->Actual functions.

 

This is worsened on Linux, based on the video drivers in use, or at least, that is the feeling that I get. Gnome runs slowly on my systems in general, so I suspect the integrated Intel chipset drivers, of poor rendering capabilities, and possible, that they are not using all of the facilities available to them. (I haven''t tried to run ZC purely from a shell login.)

 

As I say, to my knowledge, ZC Uses Allegro v4, which is not available for Android or iOS, although Allegro v5 is. I have no idea how difficult it would be to shift ZC to Allegro v5, or if it is already using the latest stable release. I suspect not, but as I said, I'm not one of the developers. Allegro v4 does have some unofficial ports, making it possible to build ZC on other platforms, mostly those that no-one uses; and it should be possible to do system-specific builds, optimised for specific CPUs, or GPUs (someone may want to clarify this), but without the ZC sources, that is a technological cul-de-sac.

 

The real question here is, dhow many people would even run ZC on a phone, if it was available? The ZC community has actually decreased in size over time, due to lengthy delays in the release of 2.5; which was originally planned for what? 2005-ish? It's one of those things, where you discover it, and immerse yourself in the culture, and then discuss it with mates, only to find they've never heard of it. Porting it to any other platform is a huge amount of work, and the number of people doing basic maintenance, and responsible for the latest version, are so few, that you can count them on one hand.

 

Asking for ports to systems, where using ZC requires add-ons, hacks, or other obscure items, is simply too much. We all have a laundry list of 'wish' features for ZC, that have to generally take priority over porting it to a system, that may not even be around, by the time that a port is complete. If you wanted to port ZC to iOS, as an example, and you knew that it would take four years to do it: Why would you bother?

 

OS will be significantly different by the time that you finish the port, and may no longer even be a mainstream OS by the time that the port is ready. You are better off, as a programmer, to wait for technology to pace up, and catch up; so that mobile devices are as powerful at the expected date of completion, comparable to portable systems, such as laptops, are at present. If you are a small team of developers, working for a non-profit goal, then you have to prioritise features, and feature-requests, that the majority of your users will want.

 

I just don't see ZC on phone architecture working well, even if it was available. I think it might tax the Pandora, and well, mobile phones have less power than that. They don't have to be as underpowered as they are, but no manufacturer would be willing to produce a mobile device that is comparable to a laptop, given the inherent cost involved. That is why the design that i created in 2000-2002 was ultimately rejected. The manufacturing cost, per unit, at the time, was in excess of £2,500. With a 40% margin, which is the base minimum for a vertical market device, the expected retail was £3500, or $6,000 to $7,000.

 

That  what you would expect to pay today, for a hand-held device with laptop to desktop power, assuming that the components are available, or possible to produce with the present tooling, wafer sizes/pitch, etc..

 

The coming Linux-based phones, may be able to run ZC but not at much of a speed improvement, as they are simply not designed to run desktop software, will lack critical dependencies that you will need to re-add, and be generally devised to run phone-oriented software, which is in its nature, not graphics intensive; and it is the graphical conversion between Allegro, the local APIs, and the GPU, that slows ZC down on various platforms.

 

I should really buy a Pandora, just because it is such an interesting device, and to test it with things like ZC, to gauge its usability as a pocket computer. I would love a monocular viewer for something like that. (You can keep the Google Glass: I only desire its display.)

[nandobyker]

is true , not much people playng zelda classic, i guess it will never happend to port on android, but thanks for all your comments, i will keep an eye of that open pandora device or something similar to that