121 replies to this topic

[Geoffrey]

DoR mountains are easy, you just have to get the hang of it.

Anyway, back on topic, I think things like a combo type editor or, uh, I'll just demonstrate it:
Walkability, instead of this:

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Would be like this:

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So basically 16x16 instead of 2x2.

[Gleeok]

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I'm not sure that zc would be able to handle collision maps or pixel-perfect-collisions the way it's currently set up.

Now that I think about it, I think the big question post 2.5 is: 'Screen Scrolling.' Who want's it, and what is the price?

[Banjo7J]

People will continue to make quests and the devs will make 3.0. Besides, the whole argument about straying from the original game is kinda invalid; people don't have to use new features if they don't want to. There are still some people who use only 1.92 and even 1.90.

Also, since most people seemed to have posted what they want to see in 3.0;
More combo-types such as Ice, Lift and Jumpable (solid but possible to jump over)
The ability to make bigger push blocks without a script (2x2 push blocks, 2x1 push blocks, etc.)
Those levers from FSA that you can pull
Overhead being an option for a combo, rather than a combo type
Scrolling. Not just Z3 scrolling but more than that. I want the ability to make scrolling similar to that of the Mega Man games; I want the option to make an area consisting of, say, 5 screens that scrolls and once you reach the edge of those 5 screens, it scrolls like in LoZ.

Edited by Banjo7J, 15 April 2010 - 06:04 AM.

[ShadowTiger]

I'm not sure that zc would be able to handle collision maps or pixel-perfect-collisions the way it's currently set up.

I don't think it'd have to be pixel perfect. I think the next best thing would be to have "slide" surfaces, where if you walk into this diagonal, you'd slide along its surface rather than be stopped by it, similar to what would happen in ALTTP if you were juuust a few pixels aligning with a bush or something, and you walked up into it, and you'd kinda scoot the remaining pixels out of its alignment to allow you to keep moving north after walking those few pixels into the bush.

Now that I think about it, I think the big question post 2.5 is: 'Screen Scrolling.' Who want's it, and what is the price?

I think it may depend on the kind of scrolling. I think a perfectly fine compromise is that instead of having a huge room be massive, but still be considered "one room," we can instead link up one of many rooms that you've already built to be scrolled between in the Z3 style rather than the Z1 style while still occupying the same normal amount of space on the map. This way, you don't have the issue of rooms misaligning with doors.

[Christian]

If 2.5 is taking 7 years to develop....3.0 will take 10 years or more. Most of us won't be around then. I know I'll be married with kids

[Moosh]

Something I'd like to see would be the ability to write scripts within the ZQuest editor itself instead of importing them as text files...Also maybe more options for FFCs (follow link ect.) without needing to script. I also think its about time they made the sign/npc script into an actual feature...

[Daemon]

Something I'd like to see would be the ability to write scripts within the ZQuest editor itself instead of importing them as text files.

You can already do that.

[Joe123]

The built-in text editor is painful to write in though.

[Gleeok]

The built-in text editor is painful to write in though.

There's a built in text editor?

If 2.5 is taking 7 years to develop....3.0 will take 10 years or more. Most of us won't be around then. I know I'll be married with kids icon_razz.gif

Yeah. I honestly can't see why it would take much longer though. Saffith and L have been fixing all kinds of things recently even though me and Joe (mainly me =P ) have been goofing around with 2.6 scripting upgrades. There's literally like four (possible) critical issues remaining before anyone cannot argue that a release candidate process should not begin at any reasonable time. I mean I haven't had zc crash in over three months now, and this is also trying to reproduce crashes that people report. That has to be some kind of record. I will say that somewhere around revision 600-700 it looked pretty bad, but compare where it's at now with the last 600 builds and you can see a big improvement.

As for 3.0 I can honestly say that I won't be working on it. Mainly because it would take way too much effort and time to try and conform a non-conforming code base, but also because by 2.6 I'll of run out of allegro functions to work with. XD Not to mention it would be faster to start from scratch at that point. ..Which is perfectly do-able as long as someone can be a dedicated script-parser guy, and we have someone who is good with gui code (not me), and if I'm still around I'd be happy to put in a solid OpenGL rendering architecture. Those IMHO are the major and most difficult roadblocks for 3.0 or a re-write...or whatever.

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[Freedom]

There's a built in text editor?
Yeah. I honestly can't see why it would take much longer though. Saffith and L have been fixing all kinds of things recently even though me and Joe (mainly me =P ) have been goofing around with 2.6 scripting upgrades. There's literally like four (possible) critical issues remaining before anyone cannot argue that a release candidate process should not begin at any reasonable time. I mean I haven't had zc crash in over three months now, and this is also trying to reproduce crashes that people report. That has to be some kind of record. I will say that somewhere around revision 600-700 it looked pretty bad, but compare where it's at now with the last 600 builds and you can see a big improvement.

As for 3.0 I can honestly say that I won't be working on it. Mainly because it would take way too much effort and time to try and conform a non-conforming code base, but also because by 2.6 I'll of run out of allegro functions to work with. XD Not to mention it would be faster to start from scratch at that point. ..Which is perfectly do-able as long as someone can be a dedicated script-parser guy, and we have someone who is good with gui code (not me), and if I'm still around I'd be happy to put in a solid OpenGL rendering architecture. Those IMHO are the major and most difficult roadblocks for 3.0 or a re-write...or whatever.

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A couple weeks back, and feel free to go confirm this by LOOKING in the bug report threads on AGN, there were basically 2 people using Zquest for it's real intended purpose, and reporting bugs.
Pokegamer, and me.

we were BOTH getting crashes out the arse.

Just because you don't see them. and can't find them, doesn't mean they are not there.
They are there.
Try going the whole route and actually building and releasing a quest with it.
I mean... I went over a year and never opened Zquest, and miraculously never saw a crash in all that time.
;O)

[Plissken]

It's funny freedom...because I use ZQ every day and I always repeatedly check your crash reports and *gasp* I never get a crash. I haven't had a crash since around the build 900 era and I always update and like I said, I use it every day.

I dunno how you always seem to get crashes, maybe it's your system, but all I know is that myself and several others rarely (if ever) get crashes anymore. I tried to duplicate your crash upon entering tiles for about 2 hours with nothing. And upon reading jman's and gleeok's posts at AGN they are trying to help you with it too. Just because he didn't get back to you for a couple of weeks isn't a reason to get mad at them, ZC isn't their life. You seem to think you're alone in trying to get ZC on track, but really you only damage the process because you take one step forward with reporting, and then two steps back in every post by continuously criticizing the devs while they are trying to help you. Your attitude in every single post about ZC is sour. And yes, you do help by reporting bugs, but then you get all up on the devs case when they're trying to help you because they can't help you fast enough or something.

Look I'm all for bug testing and getting a stable version out (which I've seen nothing but stability since the 900 or so build, but hey that's just me I only use the program every day with no problems except the minor annoyance bug once in awhile.), but you have to play ball. It's just when reading your post I just get the sense of "The devs owe me" attitude all the time. The devs are making you a free program, trying to assist them in a constructive way, and don't be surprised that when you treat others like crap, people suddenly don't like directly working with you.

Now, go outside and ride your hog.
;O)

Edited by Plissken, 24 April 2010 - 10:35 AM.

[Saffith]

I do believe Joe, L, Gleeok, and I are all working on quests, among other projects . There's certainly no problem of underuse.

[Russ]

Freedom, it crashes that often for you? I've only had it crash once in the last three months, and that was probably because I was trying to run four other programs at the same time. ZC seems stable enough to me.

[Freedom]

It's raining Plisken ;O)

I would consider it being my system if it was just one computer, but it crashes on both of mine, and Elise's too, both in Zquest and in the player, and with different quest files.

As prolific as the crashes are, I really see no reason that someone really looking for them won't find them.
Blaming my system or paint shop pro, is a waste of time, and if reporting bugs is going to be a waste of time, then why do it?
It's really that simple, and yes, bull**** like that pisses me off, and if me being pissed off by their bull**** responses pisses them off then so be it, such is life.


Jman made a big deal of how "we" can help, and then failed to respond at all for a month, if he doesn't have time for it that's fine, but in turn don't waste my time either.
I was sitting there ready willing and able, to help find that crash bug, and he was off doing something else and didn't even have the common courtesy to take 1 minute and respond that he got the user dump I sent him.
So yes, it pisses me off when someone requests something of me and then doesn't even bother to respond when they are supplied with it.

Freedom, it crashes that often for you? I've only had it crash once in the last three months, and that was probably because I was trying to run four other programs at the same time. ZC seems stable enough to me.

When I was using it several hours a day finishing up SwanSong Genesis for release, yes it was, but only going in playing with it an hour here or there, I get very few crashes

Edited by Freedom, 24 April 2010 - 12:19 PM.

[Plissken]

So yes, it pisses me off when someone requests something of me and then doesn't even bother to respond when they are supplied with it.

Did he request it in a PM or something? Cause, by just going from forum posts you reported the problem and then sent him the file, he never requested anything. Was he even active during that period? I dunno, but the thing is, calm down cause he eventually did get back to you and he's trying to help you.

You seem to think people aren't trying to help you when they are helping you at that moment. It'd be incredibly frustrating for anyone to deal with that type of situation.

And I've searched high and low (as have many others) for your tile crash, and we can't replicate it. I'm sorry these magical crashes only happen to you, but maybe it's just ZC telling you to move onto different things. ;O)