7 replies to this topic

[Alucard648]

Being grown in times of ancient video games, where dying X tmles results in invariable wiping of all hard-earned progress, sometiles with horrible bad ending sequence. I think that nowdays this grown way too lax with it. What do you mean?

Edited by Alucard648, 16 December 2024 - 08:39 AM.

[Russ]

I think this one really depends on your quest's design. With that said, in most cases, I think punishing the player for deaths is going the wrong direction. If the player is dying repeatedly, the game is a challenge for them. Making the game harder as a punishment only lower the odds that they'll be able to finish it, creating a rich get richer poor get poorer sort of situation. If anything, I'd argue that a higher death count should result in the game easing up a bit. The goal, generally speaking is for players to see the end of the game.

 

Now with that said, there are cases where that's not true, where deaths are meant to be a very punishing thing and the emphasis is on avoiding it at all costs. However, that requires a very specific sort of game with a very fine-tuned difficulty, and frankly, that's not typically where ZC quests are at. If you do end up tying something negative to death count, my warning would be to be very, very careful about it and to ensure the entire game is designed around that; it can't just be added as an afterthought.

[Moosh]

I'd maybe take it a step further and say that even bragging rights can be bad. The very existence of a death counter puts some players in a bad frame of mind that leads to increased frustration as they link the number going up as a direct correlation with their own level of skill and personal value. Some quests might see a benefit from having it, but I wouldn't mind seeing it repurposed to track something else, for example, a completion percentage.

[Alucard648]

On top of that, death counter can be cheated with F6 at last moment, most commonly while being low on HP in boss fight (and faster retry as bonus). The only counters against in 2.53, beside scripts were: skip continue screen (can be annoying depending on placement of save points, plus long loading time), instant killers (hello death pits in old school games), and continue with less than full HP (very annoying regardless of quest design).

EDIT: LsiCV had a cancelled hard mode that required no deaths run to unlock.

Edited by Alucard648, 17 December 2024 - 02:52 AM.

[Mani Kanina]

I've considered, on multiple occasions, to write a script that just randomizes the death counter every time you save the game.

That should probably tell you all you need to know about my stance on the thing.

[Deedee]

okay but what if I set the death count to 999 at quest start and subtract from it any time the player does something cool or sick. Write an AI to track epic gaming moments and give you a better score based on them. Add the touhou graze system where the more you hug enemies without getting hit the less high your death count is

[Mani Kanina]

I'm more partial to turning it into a completion percentage like Moosh suggested, tbh.

[Alucard648]

Also did the same request in Discord.