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Let's Play Forum Rule Changes


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#31 NewJourneysFire

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Posted 18 December 2016 - 05:24 PM

I'm personally just gonna opt out of the LP forums entirely. :P A place to drop (or spam according to some comments here) videos is essentially all I ever used it for. Sad to say but it's true. I at least put a lot of effort in my video drops.

Only the most "popular" channels are gonna promote conversation and communit engagement, and that conversation will only exist on their twitch and YouTube pages. I said this before Nick's rule changes and I'll say it now. I went with Nick's changes after initially opposing it because I actually liked having a personal format.

But as far as encouraging conversation? I'm not a really popular channel and I've been at this long enough to know I won't be, and I feel these rules only direct people to more popular Let's Players than hard working active ones.

With that said, people know where to find me. They can subscribe to my YouTube and twitch and follow me that way from now on. The LP forums can have all the conversation it wants, but I predict it will become rather baron and unused instead, only to bring the grim reality that the goal these rules are trying to achieve can never be. :P Then the LP forums will be removed or more rule changes made. Lol

#32 Aevin

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Posted 18 December 2016 - 05:42 PM

Alright, so we've talked this over, and taken all your suggestions in mind. I'll say up front that this whole thing is a tricky situation, and I won't pretend that we have a solution that's going to satisfy everyone. But this is what we're going with.

 

The new rule is going to remain largely in place. However, we're going to try to be a bit more flexible with how we enforce this. The real intent behind the rules is to prevent "link dumps." We're not okay with daily posts that include nothing but a link, or an incredibly cursory, substance-less description to "technically" be within the rules. Any rules we've made here have been for the goal of eliminating this kind of behavior. We're not okay with the link dumps. And we never will be.

 

However ... This stuff isn't at all meant to hamper the ability of community members who really are making an effort. We don't wanna scare anyone off here, and the vast majority of "what about THIS kind of post" questions we're seeing here, I feel like would be totally okay. We're going to make an effort to target the specific problematic cases, while remaining flexible with the forum in general.

 

What's this mean? Basically, as a rule of thumb ... the more frequently you post, the more important it is that your posts have substance. I feel that if you haven't updated in a few weeks, you'll have plenty to talk about when you do update ... but it also means that you're so far away from the "link dumping" behavior we're targeting that we probably won't be looking too closely. If, however, you're posting every single day, we're going to expect more than just a cursory "here's part 3 the water level". If you're going to post every day, you need to make a strong effort to justify it and add content that's going to be a benefit to the forum. And if you're updating multiple times each day ... Yeah, that's just not going to work. Consolidating your video updates into a single, substantial post would be the ideal way of handling something like that. Frequent daily bumps purely for the sake of bumping ... That's really what we're objecting to, here. If you want to be excused from the "no daily bumps" rule, then convince us by making your content great.

 

The intent here is to crack down on the link dumping behavior, while allowing some flexibility so as not to interfere with people posting regular updates. The more frequently you post, the bigger obligation you have to make it worthwhile. And as far as getting in trouble for this stuff ... We will contact you with a notice before taking any kind of action, so there's no worry of suddenly getting slapped with warning points out of the blue.

 

If there's any questions or concerns about this, please speak up here, and I'll make an effort to clarify things. However, at this point we feel like everyone's suggestions on the forum rules have been heard, and our stance here is unlikely to change. I'm happy to offer clarifications, but I won't be participating in debates or defending the decision.

 

Thank you all for your thoughts and suggestions.


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#33 NewJourneysFire

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Posted 18 December 2016 - 05:48 PM

With that said, I'll return to the LP Forums using my normal format, and probably improve the format with a few minor touches if that's okay with you guys. 


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#34 Mitsukara

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Posted 18 December 2016 - 06:16 PM

Thinking this over, as a person who watches a bunch of the channels that are connected to this place but never really paid any attention to the LP forum... an idea occurred to me.

 

Would it be possible to set up something akin to the Quest Project pages, where each LPer can set up one project-type page for themselves, and then post whatever kind of updates they wanted on that page? (Similar to posting an update for your own quest project, so that it only really appears on the one project page). That way, if you like a given LPer and want to track them here instead of on youtube (as I think Zoria has been talking about), you could follow their LP Project page thing, and get the little notification thingy (in the upper-right profile stuff area) showing that someone updated. And then people who don't know what to say, but want to announce 'hey guys, I have another video' can use that, without clogging up a generalized forum space for it.

 

I hope that explanation of the idea made some kind of sense. If so, does that sound possible/workable/of interest to anybody? I would think it might be within the capabilities of the existing resources the site uses, and a more coherent way to organize this stuff. Also, as a person who watches a bunch of LPs but never really made good use of the LP forum in it's current state; I think I'd be more inclined to actually use something that was formatted that way.


Edited by Mitsukara, 18 December 2016 - 06:17 PM.

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#35 pixcalibur

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Posted 18 December 2016 - 06:53 PM

This whole "discussion" thing is going to be proportional to how popular you are on this site.  Even if someone has 50K subs on YT, they may not generate much "discussion" here given most of their subs find them via YT subs and searches.  The LP threads are not going to be where most of the traffic will come from.  For example, NJF is going to generate much more discussion on his LP threads than I and many others ever will.

 

So in my case, the links to specific LP's and YT, in general, will be in my signature.  I try to keep those playlists updated.  So may as well post an update after every few videos.  There's not much to say in my stuff given the whole run is already done even before uploading the first part.  I suppose "discussion" could be generated if I do one of those highly popular quests like IoR or something else along those lines.



#36 NewJourneysFire

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Posted 18 December 2016 - 08:50 PM

For example, NJF is going to generate much more discussion on his LP threads than I and many others ever will.

 

I had no idea. I always thought myself as one of the lesser popular Lets Players here, but I guess I may have sold myself short a little. 



#37 Nathaniel

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Posted 18 December 2016 - 08:58 PM

To be fair NJF, I know you more than some of the other LPers for one simple reason:  I often see you posting in other forums.  I think that helps somewhat.  Those that mostly or completely reside in one particular forum (be it LP or a different one) tend to be less known on this site.  And for you it's natural to be in multiple forums, since you have plenty to say about a lot of things, and your interests in ZC certainly stretch to more than just LPs.



#38 pixcalibur

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Posted 18 December 2016 - 10:01 PM

Yeah, helps when you genuinely have stuff to talk about. Would not be good to post everywhere just to post, as that gets annoying real quick.

In this case, better to find a couple of outside threads that pique your interest and generate discussion from there. Random life events and non-LP topics can naturally get discussions going.

So NJF, LP threads are one thing, but when you can strike up casual conversations on other threads, those threads tend to get plenty of talk given life stuff always updates as you go along and new things develop. Video game recordings can only go so far, unless you have like 50K subs and do LP's for a living or something.

For example, I think there's a thread named "What did you do today?" that is just a wild card for topics. Very easy to generate stuff from a broad topic compared to a more narrow-ranged topic

Edited by pixcalibur, 18 December 2016 - 10:06 PM.


#39 TK8305

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Posted 19 December 2016 - 12:19 AM

I can't speak for others, but I'm usually sold on a Let's Play by the first post, not the 22nd. And then I get updates on that LP through my Youtube subscriptions. I mean obviously you guys can let us know if you lose significant viewership as a direct result of the change, but I don't really foresee that happening.

 

Well yeah if most from this site are subbed to you already on the Tubez then I guess the no thread bump shouldn't hurt anyone.  



#40 grayswandir

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Posted 19 December 2016 - 03:49 AM

This is only partially relevant, but I wanted to mention it here since it's kinda related.

 

What I'd really like to see is the ability to link to LPs of ZC quests from the quest pages themselves. About the only time I go to the LP forums is when I'm looking for any LPs of a specific quest, so having them all gathered on a relevant page would be very useful to me. At the same time, this would also provide a lot of information about the quest on the quest page itself. Watching a video on the quest will be a lot more informative than any number of reviews and such. And if there's like 10 separate LPs for a quest, you'll know it's "interesting", even if it otherwise has a low score.


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#41 Russ

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Posted 19 December 2016 - 04:06 AM

That ability is there. Quests can be linked to help threads and LP threads, and the threads can all be viewed from a quest's "Forum Topics" tab. Part of the problem is that it relies on thread creators asking us to link the LP to the quest, which rarely happens, or the staff being super active in the LP forum, which doesn't always happen because of the aforementioned aversion to link-spam.

I guess, to that end, I do wanna stress. LP creators, feel free to PM us or post in the dropbox asking us to link LPs to quest. It helps with organization and nets you more potential viewers. Win-win. ;)

#42 NewJourneysFire

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Posted 19 December 2016 - 04:49 AM

It's probably important to note that you guys are not asking people to follow my exact format, because it may seem some people may feel discouraged or pressured into the notion of "Just do what NJF is doing" and still may not want to continue because it stifles individuality and creativity. I feel with that thought though, people may be completely missing the point. I'd like to believe what you guys are suggesting is that people get more creative with their formats and not just copy and paste my format. :P


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#43 Anthus

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Posted 19 December 2016 - 07:39 PM

It's probably important to note that you guys are not asking people to follow my exact format, because it may seem some people may feel discouraged or pressured into the notion of "Just do what NJF is doing" and still may not want to continue because it stifles individuality and creativity. I feel with that thought though, people may be completely missing the point. I'd like to believe what you guys are suggesting is that people get more creative with their formats and not just copy and paste my format. :P

 

I think what they mean by "do it like NJF" is, "use effort, and make actual posts" :P

 

I didn't comment on the revision yet, but I think it will work pretty well. I know there are still a few people who might not like it, but it is better than it was, and there was a compromise, which is good! :)


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#44 Eppy

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Posted 20 December 2016 - 06:51 AM

I guess, to that end, I do wanna stress. LP creators, feel free to PM us or post in the dropbox asking us to link LPs to quest. It helps with organization and nets you more potential viewers. Win-win. ;)

You know, I'd do this, but I don't think anyone would want to link every quest I've done a video on(There's a lot, A LOT)



#45 NewJourneysFire

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Posted 20 December 2016 - 09:59 AM

I hope you guys are a fan of these kind of posts.


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